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Comments on Whi86tey's Review

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Whi86tey Sunday, June 27th, 2004
Period of
Field Use:
Just once
Date There: N/A
More than 5 years
Other Fields
in the Area:
Riverside Renegades is a much better place to play, but much more expensive. Much more safer.
Review: This is a truthful review and is to the best of my knowledge as I can describe it. I HAD AN AWFUL THING HAPPEN TO ME AT THIS FIELD SO PLEASE READ!!

I went to this field like 6 years ago when I first started playing paintball. I returned this Sunday June 27, 2004 because of the $7 all day open play and bring your own paint. The pavilion they have is pretty cool and they actually have bathrooms and stuff, but that is all way too far away from the fields. You have to walk up a very steep hill to get to the fields from the main pavilion. I looked around at all the people who were playing, they were mostly kids, some high school kids, and only a handful of college kids. I looked at their equipment and they were all beginners. I was thinking, man, no one who has any experience plays at this field. I can now see why for obvious reasons.

This field is very unsafe, they do not have a person at the chronograph and no one makes sure that everyone has choreographed their gun. I could have just went right up to the field without ever chronographing my marker. They do not re-chronograph guns in between games either. Temperature changes can alter a guns velocity, I guess these guys don't know?? The only thing they care about is barrel plugs; safety is more than just a barrel plug though.

The refs that ran our games were very unprofessional. There were two of them. They blew the whistle to start the game and then they just stood around and talked to each other. I thought I got hit in the side of my back and I felt around, but didn't have any paint on my glove, so I asked the ref to check me. He rolled his eyes and then very slowly, taking his good old time, walked over and checked me. It took like seriously 45 seconds for him to check me and he was only 15 feet away.

First we played on the speed ball field, which is on a slope?? One teams starts at he bottom of the slope and the other at the top. The team at the top has a definite advantage for obvious reasons. The bunkers are made of logs driven into the ground. The bunkers have huge gaps between them and are not very good for cover. I got so much spray on me that I had to change clothes after 4 games. The center of the field is difficult to move though on the sides. There are no bunkers on the sides of the field at the middle. It forces you to go into a valley under a bridge, which is a death trap. You can also go on the bridge, but there is little cover there, and two bunkers have perfect angles on you. Its impossible to get through the middle of the field without getting hit because of the large gap between bunkers. It usually ends up as a stand off between the two teams, because no one wants to move through the middle. Its just not a very good designed field for speed ball.

Next was the woodsball field, which really wasn't a woods ball field at all. It was like an indoor field, but outside in the woods. They had a really cool fort that was awesome right in the middle of the field. There were a lot of close quarters battle situations within, and around the fort which was cool. CQB is cool, but I think they should have the guns turned down for this field to like 260 feet per second. Again, another safety issue. The two teams started so close together and we were able to see each other's starting positions, this really eliminated any opportunity for a stealthy attack. There was no sneaking around on this field, which is a big part of woodsball play. This was more like speedball, but outside in the woods. Once again, the field was on a hill, which is a disadvantage for the bottom team. The field is not a woodsball field at all, so don't go to this field for the woodsball.

STOP AND READ THIS PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was involved in a "situation" on the woods ball field. I bunkered two dudes about my age behind a wall near the fort. I popped out around the wall and I shot them both and saw that they were hit, so I ducked back in behind the wall. They had no idea what hit 'em. One dude called hit, but the other dude came around the corner with his gun blazing eventhough he was hit. He was unloading on me from like a foot away so I started to return fire. He then ran back behind the wall. I was hurting so I started to walk off the field with my gun in the air. Then I got pushed in the back. The dude seriously wanted to fight me. I turned around and he pushed me again so I pushed him back and pointed my gun at his face and he backed down. I didn't know what the hell I was doing, I was just trying to defend myself. The refs just stood there while this was going on and they just told us to leave the field, they didn't even try to separate us, my teammates had to come to my aid. When I got back to the safe zone, I lifted up my shirt and I had big bloody welts all over my stomach, back, and sides. This does not happen with a gun shooting at 300 feet per second, I don't care how close. Everyone there couldn't believe the welts on my body. I went down to the pavilion to talk to the field owner. He was a college kid about my age, he was sorry that that happened and he radioed to one of the refs to have him come down to the pavilion. The owner chronoed the gun, IT WAS SHOOTING 360 FEET PER SECOND!!! That is inexcusable and very unsafe. The owner only made the kid sit out one game, and he readjusted the gun. I was very unhappy, so I left, and needless to say I will never be back. I called the police, but I signed a release form so there is nothing they can do. I can't pursue the field for damages, basically.

The playing fields are alright, but the field as a whole is unsafe. The refs do not do anything. That dude should have been banned from the field for acting the way he did, but the owner did nothing. I should have asked for my money back, but I think I would have killed him if he said no. The field should ensure that everyone has chrongraphed thier gun, but they don't. A major safety issue. Do not go to play there, and definately do not let your kids play there. They might encounter a similar situation. What if I would have been hit in the goggles, it probably whould have went shattered my mask , and I would probably be blind. What if that happened to your kid?? There is nothing you can do because of the release form. Don't let them play there!

Last edited on Sunday, June 27th, 2004 at 2:54 pm PST

Review Comments
xtremeimpulze Monday, June 28th, 2004 | 8:47 pm PST
okkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk, lets get some things straight here.

1. PBX has a person at the chrono station during the rush at the beginning of the day 12-1 when most players arrive

2. When PBX was built, they couldnt really choose their location, so some of our fields have a hill to them, yet everyone swithces sides after every game to make things fair.

3. The walk from the pavilion/building to the wods field dead box takes about 30 seconds. The speedball walk is shorter.

4. After playing 4 games you had to change your clothes, ive never seen anyone with that much paint on them.........................

5. Not many older adults play paintball, yet we always have a wide variety of players there on any given day.

6. "No one with experience playes at this field" Most of the experienced players dont spend the day shooting new recreational player, they are at the team practice. There were over 25 players at team practice that day.

7. 290 feet per second is not an unsafe speed,

8. 45 seconds for a ref to check you during a rec ball game when there were 60 players on the field is a reasonable time to respond.

9. the fields are challegning, if it were easy to get acroos the field to make it to the center, it would not be worth playing.

10. the woods field is over 3 acres in sizes, what indoor field is that big?

now on to your situation....

PBX does care about safety, thats why there is a surrender rule that is stated in the briefing before you go onto the field. YOu obviously didnt now follow the 10 foot surrender rule when you bunkered a person from a mere INCHES away. People on the field at the time also stated that you did not infact come around the bunker, rather you came over the top of the bunker BLIND FIRING!!!!!!. You obviously did not follow that rule. Now the other half of the party is also at fault, not denying that, they did return fire when they should not have, but after being shot in the back of the head from inches away, i would be heated as well. He should not have shot back at you. People also you YOU firing at them afterwards as well. The refs responded tot eh situation only to find YOU too heated to listen as you went storming down to the pavilion to complain to the owner. O i forgot to mention about the friend of yours that ran over and instigated the situation more, and what about this push in the back... that was never mentioned....
The referree was called down to the pavilion and he story in NOOOOO way matched yours. The other part was called down and his gun was chronoed shooting 300.... not 360 by any way....... The players was penalized and sat out for a game. Had YOU not blind fired while coming over top of a bunker to bunker someone, none of this would have happened int eh first place. So to all the people that read this, just realize that there are you sides to every story, which side you choose is up to you....

You think that you would have " killed the owner had he not given you back your money".........

the gun shooting 300 feet per second would have shattered you goggles and blinded you,

i was standing there when the owner tried to calm you down and work this issue out, but you stormed out in rage with your friend just fueling the fire....
the owner has been running this field for over 8 years and i dont see anyone else complaining about his actions

" i cant pursue the field for any damages" you instigated this situation, YOU caused the altercation........
I make this comment from my personal words, and with no affiliation to the field and anyone involved there, but it is people like you that give this sport its BAD name and why this sport will not become a main stream sport.

vanishpaintball Tuesday, June 29th, 2004 | 8:22 pm PST
DISCLAIMER: I am directly affiliated with this field. I have worked, part time, for Paintball Xtreme for 3 years, and I have been playing there for over 5. I was involved in the event discussed in the latter part of this "review." I have first hand knowledge of exactly what went on, not heresay, and certainly not a blown up fish story about how a poor innocent paintballer was abused and persecuted at our field.

As stated, this incident was started when one individual, the reviewer, "bunkered" two opposing players. To begin, this "experienced player" ought to know that bunkering is frowned upon in rec ball games, especially a walk-on game with MANY new players, and he was also informed at the safety briefing (which I was present for, as was he) that our field observes a 10-foot rule, and the rule was subsequently explained. Secondly, this incident occurred at a perimeter wall of the fort in our woodsball field, I was standing on the second level of said fort, where I usually stand, to get a bird's eye view of the three acre field. This individual did not bunker anyone, but (as mentioned in the previous comment) he held his gun over the (approx) 5 foot wall and blind fired, point blank, into the 2 players on the other side. For the record, one of the "two dudes" he "bunkered" had 6 distinguishable hits on the side of his mask and his neck. So thus far, before the altercation between the two players even happens, this individual has violated the ten-foot rule, our ban on blind-firing, and he egregiously overshot another player.
When I saw the events unfolding, I immediately responded by running to where the 2 players were at. In the seconds until I arrived, things had escalated into both players (now obviously eliminated) screaming, cursing, and still shooting. Neither of them listened to me when I told them to stop, so I put myself in between them and commanded that they both leave the field immediately, and that I would address the situation when the game was over. The reviewer found this to be unsatisfactory, but I had roughly 40 people on that field who paid to play, and I was NOT going to make them all stop playing and sit down so I could sort out childish bickering and chest pounding between two supposedly grown men who don't know how to behave in public. The reviewer, by the time the game's remaining 2 and a half minutes had elapsed, walked from the safety area down to the field building. He did not allow me to officiate, nor did he remain there to have any idea how the other party was dealt with.
Finally, the "hot gun" being referred to was chronographed at least three times over the day, (the numbers are as close as I recall, this was a few days ago) initially at around 275, after the incident at 304, and again later in the day at 285. Our field limit is 290 at the chrono, with anything over 300 being considered a violation requiring a penalty. The owner was penalized for his gun shooting hot, at 304, not 360. The safety violations perpetuated by this individual were also addressed, in a manner decided by the referees in conjunction with the field owner.
The reviewer, however, left the field before the situation could be dealt with. Upon being told that he violated the rules, he lost his temper, stormed down to the field building where he tiraded to the owner with a grossly exaggerated version of what happened (much like in his review here), and then he left. I saw the welts on him, none were bleeding, and none were at all out of the ordinary. I had comparable welts on myself at the time, and I wasn't even playing. For such an "experienced" player to be taken aback by a few welts causes me to wonder exactly how experienced he could be, or perhaps only how mature.
The secondary party to the incident, on the other hand, stayed, accepted the disciplinary action levied against him, and did so calmly and respectfully. He apologized to myself and the other referee, as well as to the field owner. He also went as far as to apologize to the other players for the delay he caused. He dealt with the situation very maturely, and thanked myself and the other referee for our handling of it as well. He stayed for the remainder of the day, and played (when he was permitted to) many more games, without incident.

To the reviewer: I am disappointed that you were unhappy with so many aspects of your day at Paintball Xtreme. We entertain scores of players every weekend, year-round, and have for almost 8 years now. We manage to host all of these players consistently, and have NEVER had a safety incident that involved more than a few welts or a twisted ankle. We are VERY acute in our attention to safety standards, and if you disagree, please ask the 6 people that sat out for a game that day for violating the barrel plug rule, or the 3 that sat for removing their masks in the field area.
Now to take your review, point by point:
Our chronograph procedure is comparable to that at every field I've ever played at in the last 10 1/2 years as a paintballer.
We enforce ALL of our safety rules, several of which you violated. All of these rules are addressed and explained in our safety briefing, and maintained by our referee staff, who all have years of experience and familiarity with our practices.
There were at least 2 referees on field during open play that day, myself (John) and Dan. The games were started with a whistle. We stood, as we have for years, on the top of the fort which stands at midfield. This allows us to see the maximum amount of the field possible, while still letting us get to anywhere on the field that we need to be in seconds. I don't recall the specific paint check that you're referring to, as I performed dozens that day. I am, however, impressed that you were paying close enough attention to actually see my eyes roll. Also, staying with your theme of absurd hyperbole, you claim it took 45 seconds to travel 15 feet to your location. A distance of 15 feet would put you inside the fort walls, in which case I could have checked you from where I was standing (hence why I stand there), and if not, 45 seconds for 15 feet would have me moving at one foot in three seconds. Stand up and try it, see exactly how fast that is. Thank you.
Now to the fields: Yes, our speedball field is on a slope, as is our woodsball field. If you don't like it, blame the glaciers and tectonic movements that created the landscape. Anyone who has ever played paintball, or has any tactical knowledge, understands high-ground advantage. The field is structured with heavier cover on the low side to compensate. The team starting at the low end frequently is able to defeat the team on the high side, and they did so several times this past Sunday. There are bunkers near the tape lines in the vicinity of the center of the field. Many players used these bunkers very well that day to take out opposing players and advance well beyond the 50. The valley under the bridge is hardly a death trap, and any experienced player can see the tactical advantages of the position. The same can be said about the bridge, as several people successfully took and held that position throughout the day. Some of the bunkers are made of vertical logs, and due to the natural shape of the logs combined with erosion, there are some gaps between the logs. This does result in paint "spray" similar to what one experiences on a hyperball field. I have never seen anyone have to change their clothing due to spray. I have personally played that field in 8 hour stretches and not had to change my clothes.

Now, the woodsball field. First, your opening sentence is contraindicative. "Woodsball" simply means paintball in the woods. If you mean that this is not an enormously expansive field that spans a forest, you would be correct. The field is roughly 3 acres in size. The start points used Sunday did allow a semi-obstructed view of the opposing start point. This did not hinder many players from "sneaking around" and using a degree of stealth in their playing style. It seems that the type of woodsball you're looking for might be best sought in a scenario game, and I recommend you try one. I'm glad you like the fort, it was a very laborious undertaking, but it has easily payed for itself in player satisfaction. This area does frequently become the field's hot spot, which is where our ten foot rule comes into play. This, also, is another reason that the referees position themselves here unless called upon. I understand your assertion that a lower speed limit would be pertinent in this situation, but the 10 foot rule allows safety in close quarters, while not hindering ability to play the remaining 3 acres of field area. Perhaps you should pay attention to and obey the rules next time you play.

To your closing, you have no idea what penalty was assessed to the other player involved in your on-field temper tantrum, because you left. Situations like this only happen when grown men like yourself don't understand how to behave in a social or in a competitive environment. There were upwards of 40 other people there that day, many of them were likely half your age, yet they were able to play harmoniously and WITHOUT any safety incidents for the duration of our open play. If you don't want any more incidents like this to happen at Paintball Xtreme, then I ask that you not come to Paintball Xtreme to play, as you were the cause of the situation. The behavior you exhibited is not welcome at our field, it never has been, and it never will be as long as I'm there.
As to your shock-talk about shattered masks, a paintball at 360fps will not shatter a mask. I have taken many, many hot shots in my day, many in the lens, and many of those at point blank range. The ASTM makes sure that these lenses are safe, and as long as you use your safety equipment properly and replace lenses as instructed by the manufacturer and the ASTM, you will be safe. All players who bring their own equipment to our field are instructed to chronograph their guns, and referees and field staff are available to assist with any necessary adjustments or modifications. All paintball fields have a release form, it is a necessary component to being insured as a paintball field, it does not exist to strip you of your rights. Finally, "What if it happened to your kid" is maybe the most propagandist statement I've ever read on PBReview. Nothing happened. You weren't hurt, no one was hurt. There were no injuries beyond the welts we all know are a part of playing the game.

I tire of typing, and I think I made the FACTS clear. I advise you to either grow up, or to find another sport to play, because you are not welcome in paintball with the attitude you exhibited Sunday. We have a fledgling sport, and we do not need that kind of behavior marring it. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Thank you to all who read this far, I trust that you will use all of the information available to you and come to your own conclusions. I implore anyone to come up and see our field for themselves, and I or any of our other staff members would be happy to acquaint you with our field. Play hard, play fair, play safe.

~John Case
~Referee : Paintball Xtreme
Last edited on Tuesday, June 29th, 2004 at 9:03 pm PST

OTrixG Tuesday, June 29th, 2004 | 8:51 pm PST
You got served.

pbxwhat Saturday, August 7th, 2004 | 9:53 pm PST
if you start fights then complain what do you expect to happen. oh yeah you are not very good anyway.

it_me Monday, November 29th, 2004 | 6:07 am PST
Why don't u sue the individual player not the field it's not the fields fault that some kid wasdisobeying the safety rules, anyways i would sue about 300 at the chronograph but wat ever it's just a squable between people

blader1214 Thursday, April 27th, 2006 | 9:41 pm PST
i have went there just once and plan on goin every other sunday. this is the greatest place...the reviewer should never be allowed to play paintball again and needs to get a hold on his temper!!! nice job in TOTALLY shutting him down...bc he just got majorly SERVED!!!!

kelham505 Monday, July 3rd, 2006 | 12:34 am PST
First off
I play at PBX every sunday... The refs are good and attentive... the chrono rule is always in affect and its a fun cheap place to play..
Just because you started a problem and instigated a situation there is no reason to be a bi*ch about it. It shows that you cant take a couple shots and that you probably dont have 5 yrs of experience just like everyone else said
stop ruining the paintball fun and grow up

grlpaintballer4 Wednesday, December 6th, 2006 | 8:35 am PST
i agree with kelham505.....they care about everyones safety there....they probably didn't see this thing going on with you and this guy and they probably were not sure on want to do.....this field is safe to play on.....stop giving it a bad review....the refs care about your safety and they check chrono all the time!!!

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