Making my case part two....

[Still Trench]

Magnuss55---
I find the way you locked the thread, banned my account (which was meant to be temporary in any event), and thereby avoided any rational discussion of this issue rather disturbing. I'll try this again.

Funny how you were so specific about everything else, yet barely touched on why exactly you were banned

I thought "a .gff depicting a throat cutting summed it up nicely. I also added why I posted it: to shock a basher who needed someone to come down on him pretty had. Sadly I made a poor decision and regret ever posting it.


Now is that something you would want your little brother to see?

of course not. And I regret posting that image. To be fair, however I don't reall anyone complaining at the time. However this does not excuse it and it remains something that I should never have done. I also apologize for posting it.

That having been said, are you going to reconsider my status or not?I can see no reason tat over six months after this single incident that my status should remain. I could certainly simply make a new acount with a new name and no one would ever be the wiser. Hower I am rather attached to my 'net "Nomme de Plumme" and prior to this single lapse in judgement I was a fairly well thought of member and caused no problems. (far from it in fact) Therefore I am trying to do it the right way.

Please allow me to discuss this with you rather than simply shut down all discussion out of hand this time.

"Trench Raider"

[Magnus55]

Your approach to the situation is all wrong. We have rules for a reason, one of those rules being that banned members are not allowed back. Yet you chose to ignore that rule and come back on another account. For someone asking to be allowed back because they say they have amended their way and are willing to follow the rules, does that seem hypocritical to you at all?

You could have easily e-mailed any mod or admin and gotten your point across just as well. I know I would have been more than willing to hear your case. But instead you chose to make not one, but two threads and two accounts in open defiance of the mods, admin and the rules, even after one of your threads were closed and your account was disabled.

In fact this wasn't even the first time you've done this. Do any of these four accounts look familiar? You keep making new ones even after you're banned:

Trench Raider (http://www.pbreview.com/forums/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=38976)
Pretty Boy Floy (http://www.pbreview.com/forums/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=40667)
Strosstrupe (http://www.pbreview.com/forums/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=40035)
Terrible Trench (http://www.pbreview.com/forums/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=52463)

Learn to take responsibility for your actions. You're the one who chose to post that picture. You made a conscious decision to post it, it didn't happen by accident. All the rest of our 50,000+ non-banned members had enough self restraint and common sense not to post pictures like that on a G-rated site. This is why they are still members, and you are banned. You chose to make five more accounts, no one made you do that. And you chose to make these threads which will result in you being banned.

To be honest Trench Raider, I was actually trying to get your account reinstated back in June shorty after you were banned, but before I saw your gif. You're a smart guy and probably would be able to contribute to the forums, but as you've proven today, you seem to think you're some how above the rules. But that is clearly not the case.

[Still Trench]

Actually I did email several mods. I am assuming my emails were either ignored or didn't get there at all. Considering that is it any wonder I resort to clone acounts to access this site? What other option do I have when my attempts to "go through channels" are ignored? What would you do?

Of course I made two threads. The first one was locked out of hand with no attempt at discussion.

Yes it pains me to sneak in like this, but this is certainly one of the few cases were the ends justify the means.

You too are a fairly bright fellow. If you stop and think about it from my point of view I'm sure we can come to an understanding without this endless cycle of banned acounts.

"Trench Raider"

[Calebd2]

You screwed up. You have to suffer the consequences. That's life man. :|

[edrex]

I'm gonna keep this short and sweet because I don't know trench and was not a member when he was and I also don't want any of the mods to look down on me but...
If someone goes to prison they eventually come up for parole and if they have been good and proven their worth to society they can get a second chance. Even Charles Manson is given the chance for parole.
What Trench did sounds horrible and disgusting and banning him was a no brainer. He deserved it. But if he was indeed a valued member of this forum then would it be that bad to give him a second chance?

ps: Trench: qouting Hitler in your sig does not help your case and if I had seen that before posting to try and help you out I probably would not have bothered. Just something to think about...

[Still Trench]

Trench: qouting Hitler in your sig does not help your case and if I had seen that before posting to try and help you out I probably would not have bothered. Just something to think about

Look at the substance of the quote and what it says rather than who said it. I am certainly not a Nazi. I have quoted Karl Marx and Bill Clinton in the past but I am certainly not a socialist. I have used a quote by Micheal Bachunin but I'm not an anarchist either. You can find bits of wisdom in the most unlikly of places.

Calebd2-- I agree. And I also think my long exile is punishment enough for for what was a single bad decision. You remember me be from my days as a regular in the BE forum I'm sure. Remember when you used to have a quote from me in your sig line?

"Trench Raider"

[Calebd2]

Originally posted by Still Trench
Calebd2-- I agree. And I also think my long exile is punishment enough for for what was a single bad decision. You remember me be from my days as a regular in the BE forum I'm sure. Remember when you used to have a quote from me in your sig line?

Yes, I agree that you were a good guy. But there are rules and we have to stick to them. We can't pick and choose. We can't make exception for "a good member" or everyone would be trying to get unbanned.

[Jaster]

Originally posted by edrex
If someone goes to prison they eventually come up for parole and if they have been good and proven their worth to society they can get a second chance.

I understand where you're going with that and you're right. The difference is that person up for parole doesn't bang on the parole officers door all day saying "let me out, let me out. What I did was wrong and I know it, so let me out." They have to do their time and wait until called upon for the opportunity to be let out. The parole has to be earned, they don't get to demand it.
That compared to this situation, Trench should have, IMO, sent his one email or PM after being banned to make his case and left it at that and had some patience for the mods to decide if he gets his "parole" or not. That decision, whether anyone likes it or not, is up to the parole board (the Mods). The offender in either case does not have a say in the decision. He must simply live with the decision that is made. Those who show signs of aggitaion or aggravation or even flat out anger usually are passed over on parole day. Mainly due to their own actions. In this case Trench believes, as he stated earlier, "the end justifies the means". That is very rarely the case. He's broken at least a 1/2 dozen PBR rules in trying to prove his case about being a good member. Last I checked good members follows the rules. His actions then and now continue to disrupted this site, those who view it, those who manage it and lastly own it. Many people come here to learn. These people include parents, town council people, children, company reps...who have to see a guys head getting cut off for the sole purpose of showing displeasure with another's post. All along continuing to violate PBR's rules. I can't see continual and consistent violation of rules as being a good basis to lift anyone's banned status.

Trench, you may have been a great member at one time but right now you're not. IMO a simple apology for your actions and a polite walk through the out door is your only option at redemption. Recognize that you've lost this one and take it like a man. I'm sure in time your past quality could overcome this blemish now. However that would depend on how you handle the rest of this. My suggestion to you is walk away and wait for the "parole board" to get a hold of you when they are satisfied that you've learned your lesson and done your time.

[amzng_spyderman]

when i was told you posted a .gif of a man getting his throat slit i figured it was something along the lines of when michael meyers slits the cop's throat in halloween 2. after seeing the actual .gif you posted, well... you're sick. plain and simple. pbr doesn't need you here.

[Still Trench]

I find the parole analogy rather amusing as I've been involved with the crimnal justice system of m state for 12 years. (I work for them beofre anyone gets the wrong idea)

Two quick points:

His actions then and now continue to disrupted this site,

Hardly. My comments regarding my former banning have been largely restricted to this forum. (Yes i addressed it in a thread, but that was in response to a comment by another user and before I knew of this particular foru.) Last I checked, this particular forum was dsigned to discuss site issues and the like. If I were hel bent n disrupting the forum I would be spamming multible forums with my case and proceding in a far more agressive and abusive manner.

I have more class than that.

I'm sure in time your past quality could overcome this blemish now. However that would depend on how you handle the rest of this. My suggestion to you is walk away and wait for the "parole board" to get a hold of you when they are satisfied that you've learned your lesson and done your time.

I would be willing to do that if I had faith in the system that banned me in the first place. (I feel I should have been given a warning to "cool down" on my first offense, but that's beside the point now) The problem is that I doubt any effort will be made to contact me at a later date. (I doubt any of you have my home email address anyway) I doubt that my case would be considered at all if I did not bring it upi. In keeping with the parole board analogy, most states have laws requiring parole review after a set time. Likewise many online boards have set policies regading the return of banned users after a set time. To my knowledge pbreview does not have this in place.

Do you see my delima now?

"Trench Raider"

[Still Trench]

BTW I would like to thank you for not locking this thread out of hand and banning this temporary account. The fact that you are even willing to entertain some dialogue in this matter gives me some faith......

"Trench Raider"

[taso_winforce]

do I get to vote in this matter?..... I take that as a yes. I say let him back him. I remember him even though I didn't care for B.E. you had to admire him for what he did. 6 months is a long time to be banned over a .gif. I could turn on the news and see something worse than what he posted. the same thing happened to this guy that happened to mack and that was being banned for no reason. Mack posted something that was borderline and he got banned. Then some mod said it was because he posted porn. far from it actually. anyway the point is you guys blow thing out of proportion.

[amzng_spyderman]

Originally posted by taso_winforce
do I get to vote in this matter?..... I take that as a yes. I say let him back him. I remember him even though I didn't care for B.E. you had to admire him for what he did. 6 months is a long time to be banned over a .gif. I could turn on the news and see something worse than what he posted. the same thing happened to this guy that happened to mack and that was being banned for no reason. Mack posted something that was borderline and he got banned. Then some mod said it was because he posted porn. far from it actually. anyway the point is you guys blow thing out of proportion.
you'd change your tune if you saw just what he posted.

[Still Trench]

you'd change your tune if you saw just what he posted

Ancient history my friend.

As i stated before that was a foolis mstake and I now regret doing so.

Why hold a grudge like you are and be such a "TR hater"?

"Trench Raider"
btw were did you see it? The .gif is long gone from the database. If you saved it for your own personal viewing pleasure I would have to wonder about you....:P *that was an attamept at humor if it has to be said*

[edrex]

Originally posted by Jaster

Trench, you may have been a great member at one time but right now you're not. IMO a simple apology for your actions and a polite walk through the out door is your only option at redemption. Recognize that you've lost this one and take it like a man. I'm sure in time your past quality could overcome this blemish now. However that would depend on how you handle the rest of this. My suggestion to you is walk away and wait for the "parole board" to get a hold of you when they are satisfied that you've learned your lesson and done your time.

Jaster, your response is very well put and thought out. Here is (probably) my last suggestion on the issue: At least give Trench a date that he can look forward to as to when he might be let back in. You know, like Feb. 1, 2004, the mods will make a decision and if he keeps coming in before then, he can expect to never be let in again. However, if he follows the rules and stays away he has a chance.
Anyways, this whole thing is tough from both sides and I hope it can be worked out to everyones satisfaction in the end.

[UTLadiesMan]

We keep everything that gets members banned. That way when they come back and say "Look, it wasn't that bad, can't we just forget it?" We can look and see just exactly what sick smurf they put up.

As far as fair judicial review... we already have enough hassle just banning people. If we had to ban people, then review every other banned person every 6 months, we would just go crazy.

It's simple. For the most part, you get 3 strikes. If you want to take three swings at the same pitch, it's not our fault.

[UTLadiesMan]

Originally posted by edrex


Jaster, your response is very well put and thought out. Here is (probably) my last suggestion on the issue: At least give Trench a date that he can look forward to as to when he might be let back in. You know, like Feb. 1, 2004, the mods will make a decision and if he keeps coming in before then, he can expect to never be let in again. However, if he follows the rules and stays away he has a chance.
Anyways, this whole thing is tough from both sides and I hope it can be worked out to everyones satisfaction in the end.

No, make it next February 30th.

[edrex]

Originally posted by UTLadiesMan


No, make it next February 30th.
:laugh:

[Jaster]

OK Trench I'll give you the disruptive part. I was thinking more along the lines of to the mods with the multiple accounts. The rset of what you said is true. You could be doing more damage. I should have made that more clear.

As for faith in the system, well, all systems have flaws. I'm in CJ too. So we both understand that. Nothing is perfect.
You must understand that the image that was posted calls for an immediate ban. Who posted it is not relevant. Had I posted it, even as a mod, I would have been banned also. I hope you understand that we are not picking on you or trying to single you out per-say. Granted you kind of are now. First time offenders still have to do they're time regardless of they're faith in the system.
To help your faith here I'll go out on a limb and probably get in trouble. Being in CJ I believe in fairness. I honestly don't know if your case would have been reviewed if you didn't bring it up. We'll never know. I'll PM you with my personal email. In 30 days email me and I will personally re-ask about your case and reply to you asap (24-48 hours) with the answer. Stay gone for those 30 and agree to accept the final answer what ever it may be. Granted you have no reason to trust me or believe me. However if you review my other posts I'm pretty sure you'll find that I keep my word. If you agree to this I'll push for your "parole". Keep in mind that is in no way shape or form a guarantee. This is most likely the best solution. The argument is going to go nowhere. You made your case and I give you my word that it won't go forgotten.
What do you say? You gonna trust me?

[amzng_spyderman]

Originally posted by Still Trench


Ancient history my friend.

As i stated before that was a foolis mstake and I now regret doing so.

Why hold a grudge like you are and be such a "TR hater"?

"Trench Raider"
btw were did you see it? The .gif is long gone from the database. If you saved it for your own personal viewing pleasure I would have to wonder about you....:P *that was an attamept at humor if it has to be said*
those who forget history are bound to repeat it, or something.

even before i became pbr staff it bugged me that you could think you're above the rules: get banned, make a new account, rinse, repeat. and now that i've actually seen why you were banned and that you think your actions should be forgotten, it just makes me sick. that's why i'm a "tr hater."

[Still Trench]

even before i became pbr staff it bugged me that you could think you're above the rules: get banned, make a new account, rinse, repeat. and now that i've actually seen why you were banned and that you think your actions should be forgotten, it just makes me sick. that's why i'm a "tr hater."

Heh.

but what makes you think I would ever do that again? I assure you that this is one mistake I would never recreate.

Or is it personal? :eyes:

*in best Darth Vader voice*
I find your lack of faith...disturbing.


Jaster I will get back to you tommorrow as I have to rush off to work now.

"Trench Raider"

[alright88]

Originally posted by amzng_spyderman

those who forget history are bound to repeat it, or something.
"


"Those who do not learn from their past are doomed to repeat it"
-Canon

that the qoute you were looking for

[Calebd2]

Bottomline: You screwed up. You don't get a second chance. You got life, not 6 months.

[UTLadiesMan]

Originally posted by Calebd2
Bottomline: You screwed up. You don't get a second chance. You got life, not 6 months.

Go straight to jail. Do not pass Go. Do not collect $200.

[Calebd2]

Originally posted by UTLadiesMan


Go straight to jail. Do not pass Go. Do not collect $200.

And there is no get out of jail free cards, You didn't roll doubles, and you've got no money.

[edrex]

Quick question: If getting banned means thats it, your done, outta here forever, etc., then why do so many people have "Banned" in their sig or above their avatar? I thought those were people who got banned but then let back in. Are they just doing it to be "cool" or were they at some point banned from PBR?

[UTLadiesMan]

Some were really banned and you are just viewing an old post. Some do it to look cool.

[LAMANTEthePBguy]

well the way i see it, by posting in these forums and making multiple accounts, you madeeveryhting worse for yourself. I didnt see the gif, but i might have let you back in, but now after your recent actions, i wouldnt.

If you had their emails before, why didnt you try to email them again? I mean why not take the safe approach, and if it doesnt work agian, then come in here.

If the mods let you back in, they would make a precedent, saying that people who get banned still have a chance to get back in. Then everyone who was banned for less severe reasons would whine to the mods and say "well you let TR back in".

just my 2 cents

[UTLadiesMan]

Another thing... since Sid and Andrew are very busy, you'd be better off e-mailing a normal mod to ask on your behalf. We have better channels. :)

But please... only ask one! I hate when I go to ask and turns out like 15 of us all got the same e-mail. That makes us less inclined to help!

[Magnus55]

Originally posted by LAMANTEthePBguy
well the way i see it, by posting in these forums and making multiple accounts, you madeeveryhting worse for yourself. I didnt see the gif, but i might have let you back in, but now after your recent actions, i wouldnt.

If you had their emails before, why didnt you try to email them again? I mean why not take the safe approach, and if it doesnt work agian, then come in here.

If the mods let you back in, they would make a precedent, saying that people who get banned still have a chance to get back in. Then everyone who was banned for less severe reasons would whine to the mods and say "well you let TR back in".

just my 2 cents

This boy is brilliant. :tup:

Someone give him a cookie, and make it a big one. :crazy:

[Andrew]

The animated gif you posted was by far the most offensive thing I have seen posted on pbreview.com. Why would we let you back when we don't let people back who post porn? Do you think you are special?

Originally posted by trench_raider
Aaaw did I offend you? Hurt your feelings? Scare you? Go find someone who cares....

:rolleyes: