What's all your thoughts on this....

[Meph]

Now we've all seen or heard of or even played in D-Day type of games. About events that happened how many years ago? Decades ago? I mean the grievances of those events have come and gone, they are now history. Personally I'm not a fan of them, I won't participate in them, but I also can see it as play-able to a degree. So long as it's still pushed on the fact that this is fantasy land and such.

But what about recent events. Would it be okay to have a game in a shut-down school and call it "Columbine"? Would it be okay to play in the Nevada Desert with 'hostages' and call the game "Operation Iraqi Freedom"? Would you expect somebody to produce a game in Maryland where the objective is to find 2 poeple who've been picking off random civilians and call it "Sniper Hunt 2004"??
Or how about a game on September 11th. Not even twisting it around with fake terrorist organiztions... but using the actual names and the game's intent is to prevent the president from being assassinated..... would you think this game is okay?

Well some people did. Check this bull**** out.

http://www.boomspeed.com/meph2003/poster.jpg

That's right. Apparently these guys have no problem making light of these events and attempting to make a profit off it at the same time. Showing a complete lack of respect to those 3000+ who died in that terrorist attack which inevitably would trigger us to go to war causing even MORE American casualties!

And nowhere on the site was there any specific bolded mention of...
"This game is in rememberance of those who died due to the Terrorist Attacks"
"This game is to pay for the WTC organization funding"
Or anything like that, nothing. They've now deleted it from their website, but their original promotional message was

911
AMERICA UNDER SIEGE

WHO THOUGHT THAT IT COULD GET ANY WORSE AFTER THE BRUTAL ATTACKS THAT OCCURRED TO OUR COUNTRY ON 9/11/01. NOBODY.
NOW THAT TRAGIC DATE IS UPON US ONCE AGAIN, AND THE AL QAEDA FORCES HAVE A NEW PLAN, THE ASSASSINATION OF THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
THE AL QAEDA FORCES HAVE BEEN PLANNING THIS ATTACK FOR YEARS AND KNOW THAT IT WILL BE ANOTHER SUICIDE MISSION. THEY HAVE GATHERED THEIR TROOPS IN THE CITY OF TAYLOR, MICHIGAN AND WILL DEPLOY THEIR PLAN AT EXACTLY 10:00AM ON 9/11/04 TO COMMEMORATE THE DEVASTATION THEY BROUGHT 3 YEARS AGO.
JOIN THE SECRET SERVICE AT TAYLOR MICHIGAN ON 9/11 TO HELP STOP THESE TERRORISTS FROM KILLING THE PRESIDENT AND KEEP OUR COUNTRY SAFE FROM AL QAEDA ONCE AND FOR ALL.

I'm sorry but this is just plane wrong on so many levels. A classless lack of respect or honor towards you, I, and everybody else who has suffered because of this event. And those who died. And ABOVE all hosting it on the 3rd anniversary of the 9/11 attack itself.

Sorry this had gone too far.

[LAMANTEthePBguy]

And I have lost even more hope in humanity.....

[Cuervo]

Forget the horrible usage of 9/11, it's not even a good idea for a game. THE IDEA SUCKS IN SPITE OF 9/11.

[Kowz_76]

Originally posted by LAMANTEthePBguy
And I have lost even more hope in humanity..... I know exaclty how you feel.

[LAMANTEthePBguy]

Cuervo has a point. I don't really see how 12 people in a confined area against 70 without markers is exactly going to work......

[Crash Danger]

Hoax?

[Meph]

Nope, this isn't a hoax. Originally the guy posted on another forum about the game trying to promote it. But got pissed off responses instead. He since has deleted that thread and tried to write a response as to why he is doing this. More actually accusing the forumers of being in the wrong for being pissed about this. Again didn't like the responses was getting. This time delted both his thread AND the entire poster and advertisement from his website (www.Splatterzonepaintball.net) in, my guess, his attempt to hope this blows over. Only it hit a nerve with me being a NYer and I won't let this blow over that easily.

[Jaster]

I don't even know what to say....
Never thought I would be rendered speechless....just wrong on so many levels.

I've said it before and this just re-enforces it:
The biggest problem with the human race is that there are humans in it.

and to think that so many people that died and fought in so many wars so he could have the right to this stupid.

[PMI_Guy]

Thats so wrong. I was just about to post this from AO.

Thats just wrong on so many levels.

[SwordfishIII]

im gonna write an email to them and b1tch about it:mad:

[travsstuff]

Wow they should be ashamed. After all that happened on 9/11 some queers want to go and reinact it. I think we should all e-mail them and tell them how much of a horrible idea this is to mock the 9/11 attacks.

[kdogg937]

Someone needs to slap whoever thought that up.. no wait that letting him/her/them off too easy

[cutomcocker1]

it was in the past...what can be accomplished through grieving and dwelling on a fact of the past?...we can do nothing now but look to the future...there is no reason to forget the ones we lost; they deserve to be remembered...but guess what: they are in a better place than here now...so why is it that we grieve?...why can't they have their scenario?

[Crash Danger]

there's a difference between accepting what has happened in the past and making a mockery of it.

[PeYToN-SS]

People are stupid

[can'tthink of1]

That is just wrong.

SOmething like DDay isn't about mil-sim, its about throwing in a few new things into paintball as a recreactional game. I am actually hoping to attend DDay, not as a mil-sim thing, but a way to go out, paintball, and have a few different factors in the game like tanks. I will be part of the 82nd Weapons Co. hopefully, where we get to make and use, or borrow, bazooks, which should prove entertaining. I don't think DDAy is like this. What the 9/11 is something thats just usng the american people to make money. And its wrong on so many levels.

[xXniTemAreXx]

I have ABSOLUTELY nothing against big games, they are very fun to play, but that 9/11 is really dumb.

[blade51]

My birthday is going to be ruined (my b-day is 9/11) now that I know some idiots are gonna be making a mockery of the events that occured. They deserve a good *** kicking.

[teufelhunden]

I saw this in the AO scenario forum yesterday, and take credit for bringing it to light. :)


But more seriously, email the field and tell them what you think.

nolimitparks@hotmail.com

below is a transcript of what I sent them last night.


Your concept for the 9/11 scenario is horrendous. Not because it’s a crappy idea for a scenario [which it is], but it is disgustingly disrespectful. 3,000+ people died that day, and here you come along to try and make a game out of an ATTACK on our people. Maybe you’re in MI, thinking you’re isolated. I live in Jersey, and from a hill I was driving on to go to the doctor’s that day, I saw the towers in flames. Well, I saw one. By the time I was done with the doctor I was on my way home and saw no towers. You could see ash and dust in the air for miles and miles. But you’re making a game out of it. You also disrespect the servicemen and women fighting for your freedom. You make light of what they’re doing, which is disgusting. On top of all that, it is downright despicable that you’re using the image of the towers ablaze to promote your game. At the image that photo was taken, people were dying. And you take it and put it on a poster as a promotional item. That’s disgusting.



Dave Calotta

Dave@*******.com

[PeYToN-SS]

Here's what I just sent.


I was appalled to see your idea of a 9/11 scenario game. It is extremely disrespectful to the families of the victims of the attacks. Your field should be ashamed of doing something like that. People wonder why paintball gets a bad reputation, well now I know why, because people like you are associated with the game.

Signed,
Peyton Gunn

[snap shoot]

Screanio games are as fun as many other games. But this one is so stupid I have nothing to say.I hope no one plays and it is cancalled. Someone just email them a link to this thread to see how much anger this "game" has occured. :mad:

[I.A.O.A.B]

oh my god, and that crap came out of michigan.. im ashamed for our whole state...

[LAMANTEthePBguy]

Originally posted by cutomcocker1
it was in the past...what can be accomplished through grieving and dwelling on a fact of the past?...we can do nothing now but look to the future...there is no reason to forget the ones we lost; they deserve to be remembered...but guess what: they are in a better place than here now...so why is it that we grieve?...why can't they have their scenario? Yeah and I bet youre going to tell me we should forget about things like the Holocaust too:rolleyes:

It is desrespecting all of the lives that were lost that day. It is taking their deaths and to turning it into a promotional item to make them money.

[heM]

Originally posted by LAMANTEthePBguy
It is desrespecting all of the lives that were lost that day. It is taking their deaths and to turning it into a promotional item to make them money.

welcome to corperate america. think of all the WW2 video games or the "America pride" paraphenila after the attacks.

besides it's just sick and when my parents saw the ad the absolutly flipped out.

[sIc]

Originally posted by I.A.O.A.B
oh my god, and that crap came out of michigan.. im ashamed for our whole state...

Yeah, this is the 2nd time in probably the past 6 months a michigan feild has been ragged on in this forum. Stupid michiganders anyway. :P

[cutomcocker1]

Originally posted by LAMANTEthePBguy
Yeah and I bet youre going to tell me we should forget about things like the Holocaust too:rolleyes:

maybe you need to read between the lines...

Originally posted by cutomcocker1
there is no reason to forget the ones we lost; they deserve to be remembered...;)

[Tipp98WhisperEx]

Originally posted by cutomcocker1
it was in the past...what can be accomplished through grieving and dwelling on a fact of the past?...we can do nothing now but look to the future...there is no reason to forget the ones we lost; they deserve to be remembered...but guess what: they are in a better place than here now...so why is it that we grieve?...why can't they have their scenario?

Do you know how wrong this is? They're exploiting the events of 9/11 and the deaths of all those innocent people. The worst part is, they're making money off it.

[cutomcocker1]

the only reason they make money off of it is cause people buy it...are those people buying not more wrong than the people selling it?...

[commando1]

It doesn't look like they will get many customers, if any, I don't think they intended to make fun of or mock 9/11 they probably thought they could make some money off of it. It's a bad idea though.

[master_chadwick]

Its pretty sad to see something like this happen. not only is it disrespectful to those who died and those who are fighting it also seems (if this were made public by the media) that it would put a big dent on paintball altogether. your average joe may again look at us as ultra militant but this time as heartless *******s as well. even though most of us aren't militant or heartless things have been known to be blown way out of preportion in our beloved sport and this isn't helping us to grow....

Originally posted by heM


welcome to corperate america. think of all the WW2 video games or the "America pride" paraphenila after the attacks.

besides it's just sick and when my parents saw the ad the absolutly flipped out.

i wouldn't necessarilly link a flow of WW2 video games to the 9/11 attacks. simply put using previous wars is a good formula for good video games. not only that, most of the time your fighting the axis anyways which doesn't involve the middle east enimies we have today.instead people may buy that other game where you beat up Osama himself at the end....don't remeber what its called but believe me it exists. sorry for that little off topicness but i had to say something about that. (of course if that is what you meant by WW2 games following the 9/11 attacks)

[cutomcocker1]

ok...lets broaden the topic:

so its immoral to have a 9/11 scenario because of respect to the dead...but its ok to have WWII video games?...what happened to respect for the ones who died then and there?...does time decay the morality of the situation?...

[malcontent]

we dont have scenario games about Pearl Harbor do we? *yes i have thought of that scituation and how to set it up, and no i didnt because it would be a slap in the face to any American walking today.*

its not about the morality of it, its the fact that it was an attack on our freedoms that we seem to take for granted now. every american will tell you that anybody who trys to invade will be sent home packing. this is OUR land. we intend to keep it. and any attack on our land will NOT be celebrated in any way that brings a happy light to it. thats why December 7th is a seldomly celebrated holiday. just as Sept 11 will become.

thats why the 9/11 scenario is bad. thats why the Pearl Harbor scenario would be bad.

DDay is a victory over such attempts at oppression. thats why we celebrate it like that. not because so many died. but because they gave thier lives in an attempt to stop the threat to our nations. its a celebration of the coruage the men showed when they jumped the beach. they were real super heros. thats why we have that scenario.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by malcontent

its not about the morality of it, its the fact that it was an attack on our freedoms that we seem to take for granted now. every american will tell you that anybody who trys to invade will be sent home packing. this is OUR land. we intend to keep it. and any attack on our land will NOT be celebrated in any way that brings a happy light to it. thats why December 7th is a seldomly celebrated holiday. just as Sept 11 will become.
The terrorists in the 9/11 attacks were not invading anything.

I see no difference in this or any other WWII scenario.

Originally posted by cutomcocker1
...does time decay the morality of the situation?...
Yes i do believe time decays the morality of these situations. If 9/11 was not brought up every other god damn minute in the news or in the papers it would not be as a "offensive" as it is now.

[Downfall08]

*clicks on thread*
*reads thread*
sigh. idiots. i cant believe people. corporate america

[asa4575]

Originally posted by Downfall08
corporate america
And it's not going anywhere anytime soon.

[E r y k]

time for me to send an email.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by E r y k
time for me to send an email.
Will it really solve anything?

In all honestly, will it do anything?

[E r y k]

yeap i believe so it will... with the amount of people on AO sending, and some on PBR sending... it will at least let them know what the public is thinking about it.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by E r y k
yeap i believe so it will... with the amount of people on AO sending, and some on PBR sending... it will at least let them know what the public is thinking about it.
But will they really cancel this whole thing just becasue some online forum communities don't like it?

[E r y k]

not necessarily... but if we show them our thoughts, maybe it will sway some of their viewpoints on the whole thing...

better to say you tried than you didnt and still let the thing carry out.

[breig]

Ill agree with all of you that this is not a good idea for a scenario. But i really dont think the actual "game" was gonna be you in a tower tryin to fight off the planes. To me it sounds like you have to save the president from getting assassinated.(almost like a big protect the president game) and maybe they were just saying that Al Queda are the people that attacked us on 9/11, and they are planning on comming back. At first, the scenario sounded like it was actually gonna have something to do with sept 11. but after i read it a few times.. it just sounds like a big protect the president game.

Would this sound as bad as the whole sept 11 scenario?

"Protect the president from Al Queda"

If you look at that title. it really doesnt bring up 9/11 at all, or atleast not as much as before. And instead of having a pic of the World Trade Center, they could have had a group of special forces protecting the president.

This is just what i kinda got outta it (after reading it like 8 times) but if u just take a glance at it, you are gonna think right away that it has to do with sept 11.

-Hope this didnt piss anyone off.

[nos911]

Originally posted by asa4575

But will they really cancel this whole thing just becasue some online forum communities don't like it?
It could if they got enough of a negative response from the paintball community. Besides, it never hurts to try.

[dog-of-Dislexia]

...and I'm not even American. I probably can't imagine how offended you guys are.

[asa4575]

What the hell are you all offended by?!

You people are insane.

Just because they are using AL-Queda as the enemy? How were they disrespecting the victims of 9/11?

I want all of you who emailed them to go email all other fields who have D-Day scenarios.

Because they are all "disrespecting" the victims of these unfortunate events.

:rolleyes:

[Empyreal Rogue]

I'm interested in seeing the answers from some of you where were bothered by this in regards to cutomcocker1s post. I fully agree with that he said in that post about time degrading morality. Well spoken my boy, well spoken.

I'm not saying you shouldn't be bothered by this, I am somewhat bothered by it. However, I don't see a single bit of difference between this and WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, or Desert Storm. War is War and War is Hell. That's what my grandpa used to say when he drove tanks for Patton's 3rd Division in WWII. The D-Day games held across the U.S. put a negative image on paintball as a sport because of the war-like image. But because these events encourage hundreds and even thousands of participants these events are the leading money-making events in paintball. These events help our sport grow; which is what we want, right?

The idea had some potential but was poorly worded and presented, how about that?

[Edit]
Whoops, poorly worded my middle paragraph. Blah, it's late. >_<

[blkbelt]

thats a degragation of our society. ppl in the states like to capitalize the horrors w/o dignity. it taught to most ppl to be consumers at a very young capitalistic age. life sux when you're a moron.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by blkbelt
thats a degragation of our society. ppl in the states like to capitalize the horrors w/o dignity. it taught to most ppl to be consumers at a very young capitalistic age.
Does this apply to the WWII scenarios as well? Or just because this one focuses more on what happened here it's a degration?

[[Infusion]BigC]

Originally posted by I.A.O.A.B
oh my god, and that crap came out of michigan.. im ashamed for our whole state...

My sentiments exactly. :( :: hangs head in shame ::

[PeYToN-SS]

Originally posted by Empyreal Rogue
I'm not saying you shouldn't be bothered by this, I am somewhat bothered by it. However, I don't see a single bit of difference between this and WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, or Desert Storm. War is War and War is Hell.

War is War and War is Hell? September 11th wasn't a war, and was an attack on innocent civilians. I believe that makes a huge difference between 9/11 and the wars you mentioned.

[p8ntfreak98]

I'd do an Iraqi freedom scenario, but not a 9/11 specific one.

Iraqi freedom scenario would be pretty fun, but a 9/11 one would just be retarded.

[heM]

Originally posted by E r y k
not necessarily... but if we show them our thoughts, maybe it will sway some of their viewpoints on the whole thing...

better to say you tried than you didnt and still let the thing carry out.

right on man. that's what i was thinking when i made that thread about "paintball brotherhood". if you try and make a difference it's better than if you di nothing at all

[baseballboy138]

Originally posted by I.A.O.A.B
oh my god, and that crap came out of michigan.. im ashamed for our whole state...

me too, I don't understand why anyone would go to that, let alone think it up and make a scenario about it too.

[[Infusion]BigC]

I don't understand the people defending this.

This is NOTHING like a D-Day scenario.

You say we wouldn't be offended by a WWII scenario?

Okay, you pull out a poster w/ a big picture of a concentration camp on it and the words "Holocaust Scenario Game" and we'll see how many people DON'T get offended.

It's the same exact thing.

Scenario games SHOULD be based and military victories and battles, and they didn't need to mention the 11th at all. Yet, they did anyways. Even went as far as to but a BIG PICTURE OF THE BURNING TOWERS on their poster. I don't know why. Attention maybe? Very disrespectful regardless.

[Empyreal Rogue]

Peyton, War or not it's the same concept. Many innocent people died during WWII, more than during the attack on the WTC, but does anyone seem to bat an eyelash? Nope.

Even MORE innocent civilians were lost during WWI because the methods were so crude. Do any of you seem to care? Doesn't sound like it. How do you think the families of innocent civilians in Europe feel about their losses? I bet they feel pretty bad because many of those innocent deaths could have been prevented.

You can't please everyone, it's impossible because this world is so diverse. Everything we've talked about has already happened and it can't be changed. The only thing left to do is look towards the future and learn from our mistakes and move on. That was in the past and this is present; the past can't be changed so lets move on.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by PeYToN-SS


War is War and War is Hell? September 11th wasn't a war, and was an attack on innocent civilians. I believe that makes a huge difference between 9/11 and the wars you mentioned.
Oh.

How foolish of me to think that thousands, maybe millions of civilians died in these other wars yet it does not matter because it did not happen here on U.S. soil so it does not matter.

You people are funny.

[[Infusion]BigC]

Originally posted by Empyreal Rogue
Everything we've talked about has already happened and it can't be changed. The only thing left to do is look towards the future and learn from our mistakes and move on. That was in the past and this is present; the past can't be changed so lets move on.

So it's okay to totally disrespect the memory of thousands of people because we can't change the fact that they are dead?

I don't even know what to say to this.

Your ignorance is exceeded only by your lack of compassion.

The loss of life in both WWs is anything but forgotten. Was there not just this year a WWII memorial completed in Washington DC?

Further more, 9/11 was not a war, it was terrorism.

Would it be okay by you to have an Oklahoma City Bombing game?

Trying to exploit the deaths of thousands of people to make money is just morally wrong. Nothing you try to say is going to change that.

I consider a D-Day Scenario alright becuase it's an event that's seen as a major victory and it's a way to remember that great heroism displayed by allied soldier as they stormed the beaches of Normandy.

However a cannot accept a scenario that uses the reminder of the mass murder of thousands of people as recently as 3 years ago just to catch your attention. It's horrible and is totally disrespectful to those who lost someone on the 11th.

Originally posted by asa4575

Oh.

How foolish of me to think that thousands, maybe millions of civilians died in these other wars yet it does not matter because it did not happen here on U.S. soil so it does not matter.

You people are funny.

WHO THE HELL SAID THOSE LIVES DO "not matter"?!

No one ever said or implied that. Your putting words in our mouths.

The difference isn't were it happened, it's that it was NOT A WAR. As stated above, it was terrorism.

Nobody is having a Holocaust Game, or an Oklahoma City Bombing Game, or a Columbine Game, or an Embassy Bombing game, or an Iraqi Genocide Game now are they? That list goes on and they are all for a reason. Not soul in those trageties stood a fighting chance. They weren't in a war battling an enemy. They were just people trying to live in the world just like any one of us, and were murdered totally unnecissarily.

[I.A.O.A.B]

BigC never ceases to pwn people.. good job BigC :tup:

[asa4575]

Originally posted by [Infusion]BigC

Not soul in those trageties stood a fighting chance. They weren't in a war battling an enemy. They were just people trying to live in the world just like any one of us, and were murdered totally unnecissarily.
Yeah so were the victims of WWI and WWII and yet no one has a problem with it.

The only reason why you girls are on your rag is because of the picture on that ad.

Get over it and quit crying.

Originally posted by I.A.O.A.B
BigC never ceases to pwn people.. good job BigC :tup:
He did not own anything you idiot.

[[Infusion]BigC]

Originally posted by asa4575

Yeah so were the victims of WWI and WWII and yet no one has a problem with it.Ummm, we're reenacting a battle not the entire war... oh, and I've yet to see a WWII scenario w/ the selling point "Thousands of Jews have been murdered by Hitler, and now he has a new target, THE PRESIDENT". Wonder why that is? Oh yeah, some people have taste.

The only reason why you girls are on your rag is because of the picture on that ad.

Get over it and quit crying.
Congrats! You have won the official "Wanna-be HardAzz that Refuses to Show Any Compassion Even When It's Appropriate Award"! Your family must be so proud, and I bet you can impress all the Neo-Nazis at school with an award like that!

He did not own anything you idiot. Ahem, it's clearly stated in the unwritten rulebook of the world that the pwnee may not judge whether or not he was pwned and that such a judgment must be made by an independent third-party. In short, the judgment is final and it would appear you got pwned. Tough luck kid. Btw, careful with that "idiot" stuff, people might catch on to your lack of maturity.

Some people just don't know when to quit. :rolleyes:

[asa4575]

Originally posted by [Infusion]BigC


Ummm, we're reenacting a battle not the entire war... oh, and I've yet to see a WWII scenario w/ the selling point "Thousands of Jews have been murdered by Hitler, and now he has a new target, THE PRESIDENT". Wonder why that is? Oh yeah, some people have taste.

Congrats! You have won the official "Wanna-be HardAzz that Refuses to Show Any Compassion Even When It's Appropriate Award"! Your family must be so proud, and I bet you can impress all the Neo-Nazis at school with an award like that!

Ah so there were no victims in those battles you reenact.:dodgy:

Thanks for the award. Maybe i have just gotten over 9/11 and have choosen to move on instead of crying foul for a silly scenario game.

By the way,

neo-nazis > you

[cutomcocker1]

isn't a war just a very large battle (sometimes lasting a couple of years)?...

anyway: if the rememberence of 2000 or so non-combatant's lives is so important then why don't we have a friggen holiday for the 120,000 civilians who died in a flash at Hiroshima...or the 50,000 at Nagasaki?...count it my friends...those are six digit numbers...

[[Infusion]BigC]

Originally posted by asa4575

Ah so there were no victims in those battles you reenact.:dodgy:

Thanks for the award. Maybe i have just gotten over 9/11 and have choosen to move on instead of crying foul for a silly scenario game.

By the way,

neo-nazis > you

And... you're done.

You my be penalized later for having exceeded the number of posts in which you actually had something to say.

Btw, there is a fairly clear line between moving on and disrespecting the lives of those who have died.

Just because your not crying about someones death anymore doesn't mean you can go rob his grave and deface his headstone.

Originally posted by cutomcocker1
isn't a war just a very large battle (sometimes lasting a couple of years)?...Nope, a war is an extended conflict consisting of many battles between two or more opposing forces.

anyway: if the rememberence of 2000 or so non-combatant's lives is so important then why don't we have a friggen holiday for the 120,000 civilians who died in a flash at Hiroshima...or the 50,000 at Nagasaki?...count it my friends...those are six digit numbers...Know what, you guys absolutely right. We should trample on the graves of those who died on 9-11 because more people died in other conflicts.

Not sure were you're getting this holiday business.

We're not angry that the loss of life isn't being commemorated more. We're a little offended at how it's being exploited and the lives lost subsequently disrespected.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by [Infusion]BigC


And... you're done.

You my be penalized later for having exceeded the number of posts in which you actually had something to say.

Btw, there is a fairly clear line between moving on and disrespecting the lives of those who have died.

Just because your not crying about someones death anymore doesn't mean you can go rob his grave and deface his headstone.
Tell me again how they are defacing their headstones by doing this?

[kdogg937]

Any1 who is defending this is even sicker then the sick **** who thought it up... you should be ashamed

[PeYToN-SS]

Agreed

[cutomcocker1]

Originally posted by [Infusion]BigC
We're a little offended at how it's being exploited and the lives lost subsequently disrespected.

i think i've got your thinking: your angry about the disrespect brought upon the dead by a profitiering enterprise using them as a basis for a scenario paintball game?...

have you guy failed to notice that the issue seems to revolve around such a simple thing as a name...its called "9/11 America Under Seige"...if it were called "America vs. evil terroist *******s" would you feel different?...(no change in the accual scenario; just the name)...

i really hope you don't think i'm standing up for the guys who are putting on this scenario...IMO they are the scum of the earth...but i like arguing...:D

[commando1]

I would like to just get you guys to see this from a slightly differnt perspective, the people who bombed the towers were actually quote on quote americans, so the actual amount of people coming into america and doing god knows what leads to tragedies such as 911, so in a sense it is in some ways americas fault for letting people like that into the country in the first place, americans need to limit the huge quantities of immigrants pouriing into the country every year, and take control of america, our america, I know america was built up by immigrants but the current sitution is a little out of hand and (/11 validates my point. Again, these guys were just trying to make a buck, and they probably meant no ill will towards anyone.
I am not a nazi, anti-american I am just trying to show you guys that its a domino effect type of world we live in one thing will and does lead to another... 9/11

-Roger B.

[cutomcocker1]

Originally posted by commando1
I am not a nazi

thats nice to know :eyes: ...

i will now share a very useful rule of thumb that i was told by someone very old and wise (not really but that still sounds cool :P )...

"a problem can never be solved by only one solution alone"
as of far i have found it to be true...

so you, my friend, have suggested that the problem (that caused 9/11) is mis-regulated (i know its not a word) immigration...what solutions would you apply to the problem to "fix" it?...

[commando1]

limit currnet immigration, kick out illegal immigrants(which is impossible to do entirely), and stop H1B workers from stealing work from americans.

I would also advise that people start doing something about all companies moving to asia (differnet reason) so that there would still be work in America, such companies include most of what we have and own such as clothes, tvs, electronics, shoes, and the like all made in china and asia, etc... but NOT in USA, you can not have a country that doesn't produce, sure we produce a few things but we mostly are consumers rather than prodecers with out producing this country will go bankrupt. Sure its all good now as chinese stuff is cheap to buy but sooner or later the asians will figure out that the dollar is worthless (since you cannot buy anything with it, american that is). Thus China will become a super power while america will fall apart, possibly civil war, though this probably won't hppen until about 20-50 years it WILL happen. It all makes sense if you think about it. America is disliked by many outside countries for creating the most wars and borrowing the most money to fund those wars. All the other countries in world combined do not spend as much as America does alone on its military expenses! If you have any questions about what I have said I would be happy to answer them, there are also millions of people who share these same feelings. My hands are getting tired so I am going to stop typing now. I am sorry this is slightly off topic but I thought these things should be brought into perspective.

Thanks for reading this,
Roger B.

[[Infusion]BigC]

Originally posted by asa4575

Tell me again how they are defacing their headstones by doing this?

WHOOOSSHHHH!!! Right over you're head.

Originally posted by cutomcocker1


i think i've got your thinking: your angry about the disrespect brought upon the dead by a profitiering enterprise using them as a basis for a scenario paintball game?...

have you guy failed to notice that the issue seems to revolve around such a simple thing as a name...its called "9/11 America Under Seige"...if it were called "America vs. evil terroist *******s" would you feel different?...(no change in the accual scenario; just the name)...

I'm not just mad about the name, I think the whole frigging spiel about "After 9/11 blah blah blah" is crap to. And the huge pictures in of the burning towers was totally inappropriate.

Honestly, it was a protect the president scenario from the sounds of it. They didn't even need to mention 9/11. They just knew it would get more attention that way. That's a load of crap.

On the other subject: Limiting Immigration will only hurt America. There will always be jobs in the US. Think of it as all the menial crappy jobs in industry that no one really wants are going over seas. The good high paying jobs will remain here, because there is a much higher percentage of qualified people for such jobs in the US. You things aren't made in the US? Lot's of stuff is made here, guess why you don't see it that often? We export most of it. Why? Bigger profit margins :D . The sky is not going to fall, and neither will America. China will be a democracy before it will be a super power. There will never be another American civil war. American will not fall. The US Economy is currently growing at the same rate it was in 1999 (yes, that's good). I have no idea why you think the US Dollar is going to become worthless. Granted inflation but a currency becoming worthless requires a real economic collapse. Yes there is a national debt. No it is not the end of America. Yes America spends lots on it's military, but hey, we have a damn good military don't we? You know what else? I'm glad we've spent so much on our military. It's nice to know that no country will ever try and mess with you becuase they'd get spanked. Oh, and btw, other countries LOVE us for borrowing money from them. They really do. Know why? The government pays them back + interest and they know the US is good for it. Other countries MAKE MONEY off our debt. Why would they dislike us for that?

Bah, you make no sense. In 20-50 years, it's more likely that we will have discovered a cure for Cancer, AIDS, and the common cold than America falling.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by [Infusion]BigC


WHOOOSSHHHH!!! Right over you're head.
Uh huh.

Excuse me while i go cry now.

*runs off to corner and cries*

[cutomcocker1]

Originally posted by [Infusion]BigC
They didn't even need to mention 9/11. They just knew it would get more attention that way. That's a load of crap.

and you come to the heart of the problem at last...it has NOTHING to do with 9/11 but a name...while it is debatable why that specific name was chosen it is most likey because it is a well known event that people can connect with...

on the subject of immigrants and jobs going overseas...i would like to point out that the US GDP is about 11 TRILLION dollars...compared to chinas 6 trillion and japans 3 trillion (but japan cannot grow anymore because they ran out of building space in the 80's...)

not to mention that china is a comunist nation...comunists have a horrible track record for economic growth through trade...plus the USSR lasted less than 80 years as a comunist nation...wanna take bets how long china will last?...

[kdogg937]

it is just extremely tactless to use 9/11 as a way to sell a senario game when it just happened less than 3 years ago. It would be like using the holocaust to see a senario game in eroupe in like 1948... it's just beyond tactless right now... maybe some1 could do this in 50 years and it would not be such a problem, but right now it is just palin stupid to do something like this.

[Bellator_Fortus]

Quite frankly, I don't believe in any scenerio game where it repeats past events of war, murder, or whatever. Making a D-Day game is just as bad as making a 9/11 game to me. You're not "reenacting" anything. That's just a really crappy excuse for playing a game. Real reenactments are when people represent those from the past, like in Civil War reenactments (hence the name reenactment). A great majority of those reenactors probably have an ancestor who was involved in that same war. They're not doing it for fun and games. They're actually representing something, so don't steal the word "reenact" to hide behind if you get persecuted for playing D-Day.

If you want to make a scenerio game, make one. Don't steal events for fun from past wars where people actually died because they were drafted and sent away from home into a death zone, or because they were just at the wrong place at the wrong time. This is no way to remember the past.

Of course, if you want to be a complete jack***, then be my guest.

[asa4575]

Originally posted by Bellator_Fortus
Making a D-Day game is just as bad as making a 9/11 game to me.
It's the same damn thing and yet these people dont seem to care.

[kdogg937]

except it isnt exactly the same thing... it is the same concept of using history to advertize a senario, but one uses an example of a battle over 50 yrs ago, and the other uses a terrorist attack on civilains less than 3 yrs ago... do u understand y some ppl might be a little more upset?

[asa4575]

The time these events occured should not matter. The same amount of respect should be shown with all the victims from these events.

I'm not saying i do not give a damn about 9/11 but many more men, women, and children died in these other events and the victims should be recognized as well.

I'm also not saying i like this scenario because it sounds crap tastic and it being on the anniversy of 9/11 is stupid.

[[Infusion]BigC]

Originally posted by asa4575
The time these events occured should not matter. The same amount of respect should be shown with all the victims from these events.

I'm not saying i do not give a damn about 9/11 but many more men, women, and children died in these other events and the victims should be recognized as well.

I'm also not saying i like this scenario because it sounds crap tastic and it being on the anniversy of 9/11 is stupid.

Except that nearly everyone affected by 9/11 is still alive. It's much closer to the front of peoples memories. It's just in poor taste to use that to advertise a scenario.

So the time really does matter. very few people know what D-Day was really like. We have an idea but it lacks that emotional connection people have with events in their life time like 9/11. So, naturally people are going to more offended by current events.

[kdogg937]

no, time should not effect the amount of respect given to the victims, but it absolutely does matter about how people feel about something. Over time, ppl forget and forgive actions. In 50 yrs, people probably wont be outraged at all if they were to see this exact same thing but right now you have to understand that people still have great emmotions about what happened. They have not had the same amount of time to get over what has happened.

edit: heh u beat me to the post lol

edit again: i never meant to say that ppl have forgotten about d-day or WWII or anything like that

[paintballer42o]

Scenario Idea? Stupid. Thought put into it? Minimal. Feelings for loved ones who died? None. "Fun"? I think not. Good idea? No.
This effects more peoples lives because it was more recent. People from WWII and things like that are pretty much over it, although they do get emotional about these things, it does not effect them in the long run.
Now, for peoples families who died in 9/11, this is going to effect them even more. It's like making fun of that date, like nothing happened. It's pitiful.

It was a terrorist attack. Not a fight. They died for no good reason. The people who died in wars died for many good reasons. This "game" is going to make a mockary of 9/11, it's like laughing at the people who died. It's just not right.
Making D-day a game is NOT like making 9/11 a game, for reasons right ^ there.

Forget about the past? I think not. Without the past, we would have no future. WIthout the past, we would not have anything to move forward with. The scenario game D-day is a great idea because people who were in it aren't affected by it as much as they used to, but the people from 9/11 are still effected by it. They still dwell on it, which is not bad. The person making this game should at least reconsider the feelings for the people, and wait a little while before making this game.

I will continue what malcontent said about Pearl Harbor:
It's also not good to make a game of Pearl Harbor OR 9/11 in that matter because it wasn't something that effected US lives emotionally. D-day gave joy to those people, as Pearl Harbor and 9/11 had people sad and down. It wouldn't be a good idea. It's not a victory, it's a sad and wrongful defeat.

[Cuervo]

I'll be hosting the Columbine Scenario Challenge in two weeks, just to make a mockery of all the idiots who support this idea.

After that, the losers will have to participate in a Hunting-for-Bambi-like scenario.

Just to review, these kids thought there was a problem with shooting naked women who get paid to run away from people with guns, who knew what they were doing, and were covered for their injuries. But it's okay to make a really, really crappy scenario out of the worst terrorist attack on America, where 2000 people died for no reason other than the fact that they didn't stay home from work that day.

[cutomcocker1]

how do you even re-enact 9/11 or pearl harbor...there was hardly a fight...

d-day i can see as an re-enactment...there accualy was a fight...i really can't think of a better battle to re-enact than the landings at normandy...

[LAMANTEthePBguy]

The scenario game has nothing to do with 9/11 and yet they plaster its images and name all over it. If anything, that should make it not okay. Thats like advertising for a D-Day game, and then re-enacting the battle of Stalingrad. It may be a poor example, but I think you get what I am trying to say.

One reason it sets it appart is that it was a terrorist act comparable to the Oklahoma City Bombings like BigC said. The people who worked in those buildings did not sign up to die. Possible death by terrorist was not in thier job description. The soldiers in D-Day signed up for that. They were prepared to give thier lives for their country. When people re-enact things like D-Day it is to give tribute to them for giving thier lives to preserve freedom and humanity. On 9/11, those people were jsut in the wrong place at the wrong time. They did not die heroicly (except the rescue workers), they were murdered. I don't know about you, but I don't really want to celebrate 2000 murders.

[PeYToN-SS]

I got a reply from the field hosting the event today.

Before you go standing on a soap box and pointing fingers, there are some facts that you don't have. First off, the person behind starting all this on the pb forums is a journalist for PB Exterme Magazine with no intgrity and alterior motives. We hired a pb scenario production co. to put on a big game for us, before we had the opportunity to look over the story line and flyer, they sent it out to a test market in the midwest region. As soon as we saw the material, we immediately pulled the storyline and flyer, this took place one day after the production co sent it out. What this no integrity journalist did was take this material to use against us to descredit us, so that his friend's failing pb arena around the block could benifit from our bad publicity. This journalist did not tell anyone the truth. I am sorry if you were offend by this, but it happened before we could get it stopped. We would never dishonor our heros.

Brian Smith

Sounds wierd, but I hope its true.

[DirtMcgirt]

Originally posted by Meph
Now we've all seen or heard of or even played in D-Day type of games. About events that happened how many years ago? Decades ago? I mean the grievances of those events have come and gone, they are now history. Personally I'm not a fan of them, I won't participate in them, but I also can see it as play-able to a degree. So long as it's still pushed on the fact that this is fantasy land and such.

But what about recent events. Would it be okay to have a game in a shut-down school and call it "Columbine"? Would it be okay to play in the Nevada Desert with 'hostages' and call the game "Operation Iraqi Freedom"? Would you expect somebody to produce a game in Maryland where the objective is to find 2 poeple who've been picking off random civilians and call it "Sniper Hunt 2004"??
Or how about a game on September 11th. Not even twisting it around with fake terrorist organiztions... but using the actual names and the game's intent is to prevent the president from being assassinated..... would you think this game is okay?

Well some people did. Check this bull**** out.

http://www.boomspeed.com/meph2003/poster.jpg

That's right. Apparently these guys have no problem making light of these events and attempting to make a profit off it at the same time. Showing a complete lack of respect to those 3000+ who died in that terrorist attack which inevitably would trigger us to go to war causing even MORE American casualties!

And nowhere on the site was there any specific bolded mention of...
"This game is in rememberance of those who died due to the Terrorist Attacks"
"This game is to pay for the WTC organization funding"
Or anything like that, nothing. They've now deleted it from their website, but their original promotional message was



I'm sorry but this is just plane wrong on so many levels. A classless lack of respect or honor towards you, I, and everybody else who has suffered because of this event. And those who died. And ABOVE all hosting it on the 3rd anniversary of the 9/11 attack itself.

Sorry this had gone too far.

aaaaaahahhahahaha....


the fact that they're from taylor michigan explains a lot. the gene pool over there is so shallow, you could lay face down in it and not drown.

i really think columbine would be a much better scenario. 9/11 doesn't have any dynamics to it really. too straight forward and very little direct confrontation.

[[Infusion]BigC]

Originally posted by DirtMcgirt

the fact that they're from taylor michigan explains a lot. the gene pool over there is so shallow, you could lay face down in it and not drown.

:pissed:

LIES!

Do not confuse my home state with southern Hick Towns! I WON'T HAVE IT!

[Hyperballin]

THATS HORRIBLE. Just trying to make money. I hope no one attends

[DirtMcgirt]

Originally posted by [Infusion]BigC


:pissed:

LIES!

Do not confuse my home state with southern Hick Towns! I WON'T HAVE IT!


i live in michigan too champ.

[f2f4]

Originally posted by PeYToN-SS
I got a reply from the field hosting the event today.

......

Sounds wierd, but I hope its true. I hope that's true as well. I also hope that journalist gets his arse kicked.

[amzng_spyderman]

michigan sucks. the only good things that came out of it are the many cars michigan produces and me.

i see one big difference between wwII videogames/scenarios and 9/11: time. the attacks happened less than 3 years ago and we're still feeling the effects of it today. it was over 50 years after wwII ended that video games with this theme started appearing. there's been time to heal from wwII, but it's still too soon for making light of 9/11.

[I.A.O.A.B]

you know what? michigan does suck... i was in a wal-mart in cadillac ( you wouldnt know where that is) and this mom was all worried that her kid was gonna turn all violent cause he wanted a dragonball(sp?) game.. sheesh.. :rolleyes: