Velocity problems.....again :|

[SilentButDeadly]

Remember that thread a made a couple weeks back about my 04 BKO getting crappy velocity? Well guess what, it still isn't shooting past ~220. Here's a list of thing's I've checked/replaced/rebuilt: valve, LPR, HPR, Battery, valve pin, ram, o-rings, and all my airways and air lines.

The only thing that I haven't checked is the noid, which I suspect may have something wrong with it. When I first gassed it up after cleaning/relubing it started leaking every time I shot even though the LPR was fairly low. The strange thing is it only leaked when I fired the gun and it would stop shortly after. Then, after about 15 cycles it stopped leaking all together.

This problem really has me baffled. I'm starting to think that I should just dump it on the gun tech guys at my field and see if they have anything to say about it, which is doubtfull since they're not the brightest bunch, but I'm running out of ideas.

On a lighter note, after I threw my halo on my friend's backup tippy people started giving me wierd looks. That gun was a beast to handle on the tiny airball field we were on. The lenght of a tippy plus the 18'' boomy that was on it and my nitro tank made the gun so long that I could rest the barrel on the ground and lean up against my tank :laugh:

Anywho, getting back on topic...... anyone have any ideas? I'm thinking I'll probably end up taking apart my noid to check everything out.

[p8ntball-kid21]

The leaks sounds most likely that it's a problem with the valve. Mayb the cupseal has a scratch. Also, check that the valve nut is secure. If you can't figure it out, you should have Kai at Rexplex check it out. He has many parts and the expertise to get it running.

[Gripy]

you could always try sending to IDC they could fix it for you.

[ShootPaint]

I bet I know what your problem is!!!

1)Degas your marker
2) Get a flash light
3) Push your bolt all the way forward
4) Sign flash light from the front of the marker (where the barrel normally screws in)
5) Look at the bolt from the backside of the marker

Do you see any light???

If you do then you have a small bolt in a big bore body. This has been a minor problem with the 04 BKO's. Some people can get by with replacing the stock bolt with a Vapor bolt while others have to return the marker to ICD for a new bolt.

Hope this helps.

[lotus_esprit5]

wow, sounds like you've already covered most of your gun.

Do what Shootpaint said. Also, do the blowback test (basically does the same thing as the flashlight trick). Put a paintball in your gun and rest a tissue over the top of the feedneck. Shoot your gun once, and see if the tissue flies off. If it does, you have blowback, which may be decreasing your velocity.

However, unless you have TONS of blowback and half your air is being wasted by it, I doubt it is the sole reason your gun wont shoot over 220fps, although it is possible.

I have heard of a Bushy that had a manufacturer's defect in the solenoid gasket which restricted flow. Check your gasket, make sure all the holes look the right size. Maybe one of the holes didnt get punched out all the way at the factory.

When you shoot your gun and it leaks, where does it leak out of? grip (indicating a noid leak) or barrel (indicating a valve leak). Does your bolt/hammer remain in the foward position while the gun is leaking? If so, the valve is being held open, probly due to a sticky ram (I know you already checked it, but It's all I can come up with) or your dwell settings on your board might be programmed wrong, i know faulty Chaos Boards can cause that problem.

BTW, have you had the SP mod done to your gun? It has been speculated that it can cause low velocity on 04 BKO's (sry travis, I've heard about several cases of that happening. something else might be to blame, but I gotta ask).

[SilentButDeadly]

Well, lets see. I'll try the blowback/bolt fit tests when I get back from school.

The leak was, in fact, coming from my noid so i guess I'll check that too, and no, the bolt wasn't sticking forward. And I also do not have the SP mod either. Thanks for the suggestions, I'll see what happens later.

[yoda101]

check your noid screws, they tend to come loose every once in awhile as well. Make sure those are nice and tight

[kl1223]

Yeah, take yoda's advice and check the noid screws. I had been getting an odd leak near the center of the tray, and when I tightened the screws the leak went away.

[Rich4444]

2004 milled or unmilled BKO? Is your 220 velocity consistant, or does it also fluctuate a great deal?

Velocity problems COULD be caused by the solenoid, if the solenoid isn't keeping the bolt forward long enough for the proper amount of air to pass through it. But, I'd be willing to bet that the solenoid is ok, and not the problem in this case. (I'm finding Solenoids get blamed too often for things they just don't do because they are the part people know the least about! ~~ we need a better justice system for the noids! :laugh: )

I'd check one other thing. Are you ABSOLUTELY positive your valve isn't in crooked? If it is turned, it would restrict air passing through it into/through the bolt, and could result in low velocity I would guess. Have you checked it is in straight since the problem occured?

Shootpaints suggestion also makes much sence, because if you get bad blowback (air escaping around the sides of the bolt), that pressure is not propelling the ball. That same problem (a badly sanded bolt that swelled) caused HORRIBLE velocity inconsistancy in my BKO :o It would have to be a pretty big leak though to cause a 220 max velocity.

Are you sure you have your HPR and LPR adjusted correctly and your tank is full? I'd start from scratch. Get a full tank (and try a NEW or spare tank to make sure that isn't the problem), set your HPR to around 200-220, and readjust your LPR like the stickies say, and try again.

The Dwell settings wouldnt be wrong in a BKO, the Solenoid doesnt return the ram in a BKO, a Spring does.

[SilentButDeadly]

Gentlemen, I believe I've got it. It seems to me that the problem does not lie with the noid itself, but rather the noid gasket. I'm fairly sure that the screws on my noid were waaaaay too overtightened from the factory because the gasket is squished out quite a bit on each side of the noid. So much that I can actually see some of the holes in the gasket where air is supposed to go through. I believe a visual aid would be appropriate so here's some pics:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v378/Killersharq/Noidleft.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v378/Killersharq/noidright.jpg

The screws are so tight, that I can't even remove them at this moment, I may have to resort to different methods soon if i can't get them un-stuck.

*edit: finally got the screws out, and the gasket returned to it's normal shape. I think there may be something wrong with one of the holes in the gasket, it's smaller than the other two. I'll get a pic up soon.

*edit, again: here's my noid gasket
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v378/Killersharq/doesntseemright.jpg
Something about that small hole just doesn't seem right, but I have nothing to compare it with. Is that normal?

[SilentButDeadly]

Anyone?

[ShootPaint]

I believe the small hole that you have in the picture is the exhaust hole for the noid. I would have tear one down to look at it but I am about 90% sure on this.

[ShootPaint]

Originally posted by lotus_esprit5
BTW, have you had the SP mod done to your gun? It has been speculated that it can cause low velocity on 04 BKO's (sry travis, I've heard about several cases of that happening. something else might be to blame, but I gotta ask).

No reason to be sorry.

There have been a couple issues with the 04's not taking the standard SP Mod that we have been putting out for the last year or so. The SP Mod does however work with the 04 we simply have to know that the SP Mod is going in a 04 so we can preform the mod a little differently for it.

I do believe the DAM mod was the one that failed in most 04's and couldnt be corrected.

I am about to do away with the SP Mod all together. It will be replaced with the MAC Ram. I did the SP Mod to help those with chopping issues and when it was copied people began to confuse the SP Mod with the DAM Mod. In turn I decided to concentrate more on the MAC Ram to seperate myself from the imitation mods that came out and the so called online plans for the SP Mod. None of these plans have been correct and it truely is a wonder that the people that have preformed these plans online have got the mods to work. I have tried a couple of them and found some major problems in the plans. At one point I even offered to fix the DAM Mods that werent working in the 04 KO's but people got mad at me because I wouldnt give the information away to them on a mod that I didnt even preform. So needless to say the information on how to correct the problem with the DAM Ram was never released from me at least.

[SilentButDeadly]

Exhaust hole? That doesn't seem very likely, since there's only 5 holes on the gasket, 2 for the screws and 3 for the ram. Actually the forward most hole looks kind of like an exhaust hole but that wasn't the one showing in that picture.

[ShootPaint]

Originally posted by SilentButDeadly
Exhaust hole? That doesn't seem very likely, since there's only 5 holes on the gasket, 2 for the screws and 3 for the ram. Actually the forward most hole looks kind of like an exhaust hole but that wasn't the one showing in that picture.

I was referring to the the last picture of the gasket by itself.

The hole that still has material inside of it is the exhaust port for the solenoid or at least that is what I think it is.

[SilentButDeadly]

Originally posted by ShootPaint
The hole that still has material inside of it is the exhaust port for the solenoid or at least that is what I think it is.
I see.
Well, that would make sense, since that particular hole matches up with a channel milled into the bottom of my ram housing that vents the air out to the side. Well, I'll see what happens when I head up to my field this weekend.

[lotus_esprit5]

yep, that looks like it would be the exhaust hole. My gasket looks different since its a B2K3, but the exhaust hole is similar in that there is kind of a channel by it to vent the air out. In the pics, your gasket looks like a pancake, that was probly the problem.

yeah I've heard about TONS of problems with the DAM mod, luckily not many ppl got it.

[yoda101]

that hole needs to be as big as the outside diameter