I was looking to buy a TES but uhhh what is up with Dragun Empire?

[Oxide]

Is the company bankrupt? I looked on their websites things dont look too good. What happened? Sorry if this is a repost


ps. anyone reccommend the TES or a FA Dragunfly?

[shonie73]

Dragun Empire was in a way "bought out" by ogi, look around in the threads, there is plenty of information. As for the site, the customer service just sucks, but the guns are great. If you're looking into getting one of their guns, i highly reccomend the drallion. In my opinion it is the best dragun empire gun. It is very upgradable, very good looking, very fast (as all DE guns are), and probably the most accurate of the DE guns. The t1 is just about as good, a bit faster (stock, but a drallion can get an eblade, and soon a t-board), bit less accurate, bit less upgradable, a bit less maintanence. It's you're call. If you like the feel of a cocker, go with the drallion.

[p8nter24]

Originally posted by Oxide
ps. anyone reccommend the TES or a FA Dragunfly?

It depense on what you want.

blowback=tes Faster rate of fire, little less consistant/accurate. Can use c02

Autococker=dragunfly slower rate of fire, a little more finiky. Need HPA/LPA. More accurate/consistant.


Two diffrent ends of the spectrum when it comes to markers.

[teswkit]

Originally posted by p8nter24


It depense on what you want.

blowback=tes Faster rate of fire, little less consistant/accurate. Can use c02

Autococker=dragunfly slower rate of fire, a little more finiky. Need HPA/LPA. More accurate/consistant.


Two diffrent ends of the spectrum when it comes to markers.

More accurate, i think not....it depends on barrel to paint match

[p8nter24]

Yeah. Sorry to say my furry little friend. Im right. Cockers are more consistant. Meaning that the same amount of air goes into the chamber every time. Making the paintball travel the same distance. The ram on the cocker also alows for better trajectory because the exact same amount of air goes to it.(the bolt in turn moves at the same speed every shot) Cockers have another reg (LPR) that alows the same amount of pressure go to the ram, to allow the greater consistancy.

Consistancy=Accuracy.

Paint to bore match plays a major role as well to efficiency and accuracy.

The reason that paint to boar size increases accuracy, is because less air gets around the paintball. This increases efficiency, which decreases pressure. Decreased pressure means that the bolt will not deform the paintball as much when fired allowing consist travel of paintball/paintballs.

Please feel free to correct me. This is what i have been taught/learned.

[teswkit]

wrong again, Consistency doesnt mean more accuracy because paintballs could be different so wat if ur shooting 280fps hell i could be shooting at 200fps and get more accuracy than you

[Oxide]

so are both of these guns legit?

[p8nter24]

if you are going to compaire a variable.

like consistancy=accuracy.

You cant throw in another varaible like diffrent paint.

I was saying that cockers are more accurate because they are more consistant/efficient.

I said that you were right about paint to bore match. It contributes to accuracy. But thats not what my original/first post was about. It was about the marker not paint.

Im not trying to get in a fight w/you because i know you know what your talking about. Ive seen you alot in this forum.

so wat if ur shooting 280fps hell i could be shooting at 200fps and get more accuracy than you Im not talking about shooting fps im talking about operating pressure to shoot at 280fps.


maby we cant see eye to eye or we cant understand what eachother are trying to explain.:) if you want to continue this just pm me.

[p8nter24]

Originally posted by Oxide
so are both of these guns legit?

I would go tes

[toothpastedog]

Originally posted by p8nter24
Yeah. Sorry to say my furry little friend. Im right. Cockers are more consistant. Meaning that the same amount of air goes into the chamber every time. Making the paintball travel the same distance. The ram on the cocker also alows for better trajectory because the exact same amount of air goes to it.(the bolt in turn moves at the same speed every shot) Cockers have another reg (LPR) that alows the same amount of pressure go to the ram, to allow the greater consistancy.

Consistancy=Accuracy.


Exactly the same amount of air isn't delivered for each shot in a cocker, even though a more consistant amount is delivered than any blow back: the spring tension/force pushing the hammer forward will fluctuate just as much as the pressure that would be aplyed to the piston in the ram.

Your theory doesn't even make sense: angels, timmys, impulses, etc, all have lpr's that lower the solenoid's/ram's/hammer's operating pressure which would, according to you, produce exactly the same amount of air release each time....

:laugh: Sorry, but the more i think about it, the worse your theory sounds:

Did you know that the force pushing a cocker's hammer forward isn't the ram, it is a spring-the thing that controls how much air is released from the valve is:
-the 3-way's actuating rod's length,
-spool valve's lenghts,
-the cocking rod's length,
-if you have an eblade, the delay before the solenoid valve actuates...

It did seem to make sense to me at first though ;)

The reasons cockers are more accurate than block backs is because, well, they don't "blow back."

-As you probably know, the term blow back reffers to air blowing out the back of the valve and pushing the hammer/bolt back into the cocked position.
-As you also seem to know, cockers don't uses a block back system, they use a three-way, and a ram, or a solenoid valve and a ram to recock the hammer and cock/recock the bolt.
-When air blows out the back of the valve to recock the hammer, air (different amounts) escapes from the breach (obviously to push the hammer back). This results in less consistant shots.

Cockers, as i said, do not use the block back system, thus each shot will be more consistant, because no air is diverted to the hammer like with a spyder/clone/blow back.

So, in conclusion, you were definitely on the right track, but the ram wasn't what makes the cocker more accurate, it is the valve's design.

[teswkit]

Originally posted by toothpastedog


Exactly the same amount of air isn't delivered for each shot in a cocker, even though a more consistant amount is delivered than any blow back: the spring tension/force pushing the hammer forward will fluctuate just as much as the pressure that would be aplyed to the piston in the ram.

Your theory doesn't even make sense: angels, timmys, impulses, etc, all have lpr's that lower the solenoid's/ram's/hammer's operating pressure which would, according to you, produce exactly the same amount of air release each time....

:laugh: Sorry, but the more i think about it, the worse your theory sounds:

Did you know that the force pushing a cocker's hammer forward isn't the ram, it is a spring-the thing that controls how much air is released from the valve is:
-the 3-way's actuating rod's length,
-spool valve's lenghts,
-the cocking rod's length,
-if you have an eblade, the delay before the solenoid valve actuates...

It did seem to make sense to me at first though ;)

The reasons cockers are more accurate than block backs is because, well, they don't "blow back."

-As you probably know, the term blow back reffers to air blowing out the back of the valve and pushing the hammer/bolt back into the cocked position.
-As you also seem to know, cockers don't uses a block back system, they use a three-way, and a ram, or a solenoid valve and a ram to recock the hammer and cock/recock the bolt.
-When air blows out the back of the valve to recock the hammer, air (different amounts) escapes from the breach (obviously to push the hammer back). This results in less consistant shots.

Cockers, as i said, do not use the block back system, thus each shot will be more consistant, because no air is diverted to the hammer like with a spyder/clone/blow back.

So, in conclusion, you were definitely on the right track, but the ram wasn't what makes the cocker more accurate, it is the valve's design.



He is RIGHT..

[ChaChuShady]

wanna buy my TES?

upgrades are...

bob long torpedo reg
apm tigershark
clamping feedneck
check it unimount
lumex eyes coming soon
lapco bigshot coming soon
32* spring kit
black grip panels coming soon
stock clear grip panels

coming soon means im waiting on their arrival
12v revvy profiler and tank not included unless u want them



http://img69.exs.cx/img69/1227/ProfilerTES.jpg

[toothpastedog]

no...

and btw, very wrong forum; go to the B/S/T forums...

[ChaChuShady]

was i talking to u stupid arse?

he said he was looking to buy a tes and i wanted to see if he wanted mine u retard

[teswkit]

ill take that reg off of u

[ChaChuShady]

sorry not parting out

[Oxide]

i did my research and decided it would be wiser to buy a Torid X(its like a more updated version of the TES). And thats what i am planning to do. Any comments about the Torid?

[ChaChuShady]

yea...TES' are better from what ive heard
but the service from odessy is better

[teswkit]

the torid x is a awesome gun,

[Pan The Piper]

i want a dragun cuz it just sounds so freaking cool. ill own ppl and theyll say "**** kid wuts ur marker" and ill be like "sall kool dawg i gota DRAGUN" and thell be like "WOW THAT SOUNDS KOOL!!" that was really random of me....

[ChaChuShady]

wanna buy mine?it easily gets mistaken for an intimidator,especially when i wear paintball pants,jersey,profilers,and it has a unimount and torpedo reg so yea ppl think its an intimidator...

[cockershtrx]

Originally posted by teswkit


More accurate, i think not....it depends on barrel to paint match .

uhhh yeah closed bolt guns are more accurate stock vs. any other stock gun out there. That is proven fact. accually paint to barrel match IS extreamly improtant in closed bolt guns because the ball goes into the barrel, unlike open bolt guns where the ball stays in the breetch. On my old impulse i only used .693 barrel because the duel ball detents keep the ball where it needs to be and will still shot VERY accuratly.

Most guns come stock w/ a .689 barrel and except high end where they let you choose. but you take to stock guns, cocker and what ever you want use the same paint, we'll use pmi premium for example and shoot both guns the cocker will be more accurate. I used premium as example because that paint tends to be mid size paint. .687 - .690.

[teswkit]

Originally posted by cockershtrx
.

uhhh yeah closed bolt guns are more accurate stock vs. any other stock gun out there. That is proven fact. accually paint to barrel match IS extreamly improtant in closed bolt guns because the ball goes into the barrel, unlike open bolt guns where the ball stays in the breetch. On my old impulse i only used .693 barrel because the duel ball detents keep the ball where it needs to be and will still shot VERY accuratly.

Most guns come stock w/ a .689 barrel and except high end where they let you choose. but you take to stock guns, cocker and what ever you want use the same paint, we'll use pmi premium for example and shoot both guns the cocker will be more accurate. I used premium as example because that paint tends to be mid size paint. .687 - .690.



wow, go to here and learn ur schooling about paintball,

www.webdogradio.us

[teswkit]

its people like you, that say COCKERS are more accurate....think wat u want to think...i and other fellow pbr members are smarter than that

[shonie73]

in general, i do agree. A stock cocker is probably the most accurate for a stock gun. But once upgraded, they can be beaten out because other guns can get just as accurate, and definitely faster than cockers.

[ruderogo]

your right, id go with the TX over the TES, because a)has better grips,software, no leaking b)has a company that will support its product.

[toothpastedog]

Originally posted by cockershtrx
.

uhhh yeah closed bolt guns are more accurate stock vs. any other stock gun out there. That is proven fact. accually paint to barrel match IS extreamly improtant in closed bolt guns because the ball goes into the barrel, unlike open bolt guns where the ball stays in the breetch. On my old impulse i only used .693 barrel because the duel ball detents keep the ball where it needs to be and will still shot VERY accuratly.

Most guns come stock w/ a .689 barrel and except high end where they let you choose. but you take to stock guns, cocker and what ever you want use the same paint, we'll use pmi premium for example and shoot both guns the cocker will be more accurate. I used premium as example because that paint tends to be mid size paint. .687 - .690.

Can you explain to us why cocker's/closed bolt gun's are the most accurate?

ChaChuShady: did i insult you? no. was i impolite to you? no. did you make a mistake posting that about your gun in this thread/forum? yes.

[TESballer]

Originally posted by cockershtrx
uhhh yeah closed bolt guns are more accurate stock vs. any other stock gun out there

so your saying an stock omen has better accuracy than any other non-closed bolt gun out there...

the closed bolt function doesn't affect accuracy at all

go here (http://www.warpig.com/paintball/technical/paintguns/balistic/closedopen.shtml) and read dunderhead (i love that word :laugh: )

[teswkit]

yes plz explain why cockers are more accurate and dont start saying it has more range also

[ChaChuShady]

just look at his name...cockerskryt or whatever...he has a cocker so thats what he thinks...

[TESballer]

Originally posted by ChaChuShady
he has a cocker so thats what he thinks...

aka ignorance

[teswkit]

yup ignorance

[toothpastedog]

still waiting cockershtrx...

[teswkit]

i guess he cant come up with one...LOL

[teswkit]

i think this a good pic to decribe his words

[ChaChuShady]

HAHAHAHAHA derr hahahaha...so wheres cockerstxkyrs?hasnt been responding

[p8nter24]

sorry for being gone. But now that i have read links and have talked to diffrent people.

I am still getting mixed answeres though (Ex.) (Cool T) Moderator

"Consistency is based mostly on a gun's reg and incoming gas source (CO2 vs. HPA). Accuracy is based on consistency and many other factors as well. Accuracy is mostly due to consistency, the barrel, and paint to barrel match, but other factors such as humidity and temperature have an effect on it too. Measuring your +/- fps on a chrono is the easiest and a fairly accurate way to measure consistency."

But for your happieness i will admit i am wrong. Your Right. Im an wrong informed person. Have a nice day:)

[toothpastedog]

Oh, thank you, you made me feel so good about myself. :P :rolleyes:

Yeh, consistancy does come down to the air sorce and regulator(s) used, but as far as valve designs are concerned, the non-blow back valve is more consistant than the blow back design.