Possibility for ball backspin

[nlh]

Would this setup be possible, or plausible, in any form?

I had an idea today, that in order to add backspin to a paintball, but keep the accuracy of the shot, unlike the flatline - which supposedly lacks accuracy - this method might work. I would like to add a small motorized wheel, or gear of sorts, that would be right below where the ball sits in the gun, and would spin counter-clockwise, resulting in a backspin effect on the ball before fired.

I am wondering if this is possible, mostly, and whether or not it's a good idea. I perceived a problem in this method; the "wheel" would have to spin very quickly in order to affect the ball enough, but would it keep spinning within the barrel, and then keep accuracy in horizontal directions - some curving upwards would be expected, until tweaked - or would the ball wobble out, etc.?

Hopefully, this works, because it seems simple and efficient.

Thanks for your time and thoughts. :)

[Shazaam]

it seems pretty sweet, and it could actually work. As long as theres not much friction in the chamber that holds the ball and if the motor doesn't get wet.. There also gotta be like some rubber to spin the ball...Nice idea tho

[Chad51]

It might not work properly and I will tell you why.

When the ball is shot the straight barrel will take away from the backspin. If you look at the flatline then you will notice that the barrel is curved right up to the last little bit of the barrel. So when the paintball is shot with your idea it will be spinning backwords and you will probably chop alot of balls on the flat bottom surface of the barrel. The flatline keeps the bottom of the ball from touching the bottom of the barrel so it gains spin off the ball rolling on the top of the barrel. With a straight barrel the ball with be spinning backwords creating friction when it is touching the bottom of the barrel slowing the ball down or breaking it.

So I highly don't think it would work but it would be interesting to see the result of accually trying it.

[nlh]

That's what I was thinking.

I think the wheel would have to be seriously tweaked for it to work properly, and if so, it would be quite gentle, and would probably not put too much backspin on the ball. I'm trying to figure out if the ball would be spun gently enough by a cushioned wheel, and, it being a sphere, would not be subject to much friction (hopefully).

I think it's possible with much tweaking, great paintballs, and an extremely smooth barrel. The wheel would have to be extremely gentle, and have a very high revolution rate.

If I had a spare M98, I would attemp to make it - but it would be extremely tough. Hopefully someone sees this thread and the idea is tested.

[FlyBoyNZ]

i think the wheel would shoot the ball out of the barrel

[nlh]

It wouldn't be spinning long enough for the wheel to grib the ball enough to roll it out of the gun. As the balls are dropped down from the hopper, they would be spun quickly before shot.

This would be an extremely fast process - it's a semi-automatic, and the ball wouldn't just be sitting on the wheel spinning for much time. The wheel/gear would have to be tweaked to a high enough RPM so that the balls can be spun significantly and extremely rapidly - the moment they touch the wheel, really. Also, since it's backspin, the ball wouldn't go forth from the gun.

[Shazaam]

if the wheel shot the ball, you'd need alot of spin which would prolly chop the ball and...the ball would only go like 15 feet

[nlh]

The wheel doesn't shoot the ball. It spins it rapidly, and adds a small backspin. I'm looking for physics possibilities, and general ideas on how to tweak this.

[FlyBoyNZ]

it wouldnt keep the accuracy of the shot becasue the wheel it in a fixed position. just modify a flatline so it in on ball-bearings

[Chad51]

The wheel will push the ball forward and not spin it unless there is something to stop it from moving forward until you pull the trigger. But without a curved barrel it still probably wont work... Sorry to burst your bubble but it could eventually work with some more planning!

[lvlatt]

paintballs are too fragile. that same meathod is used in tokyo mauri airsoft guns. bb's are also smoother than paintballs too.... you could always try something like the automag Z-body, putting something with more friction on a barrel (a line of tape down the top of the barrel), or sand one half of the barrel and polish one half. you will get basically no results from any of this.

[Creeper]

Lets say that the ball falls into the chamber, and as soon as it touches the wheel it immediately goes into backspin. The air then pushes it out of the barrel in a fraction of a second. The ball starts to shoot down the barrel with perfectly vertical backspin. Now you run into ANOTHER problem.

For the backspin to remain vertical, the ball cannot have anymore friction. This would mean the ball would fall almost straight down, as when shot without the barrel. Or, you can use small bore balls in a large bore barrel. But as your ball flies down the barrel, it hits a wall, and careens back and forth, completely throwing off the spin and accuracy.
Using a barrel-ball match, the backspin will be disrupted by the friction. The foundation of the idea is fundamentally flawed, sorry to say.

[Chad51]

I have to agree with Matt about this! Also the idea with tape does work but not quite as good as the really flatline. If you want to know more about the tape thing check out www.m98center.com

[FlyBoyNZ]

The flatline doesnt have the accuracy becasue you dont hold the marker perfectly straight. The wheel idea is good, but as the flatline, you dont hold your gun perfectly upright, so the wheel will be angled, just like the flatline.

[nlh]

The wheel would barely skim the ball, and very quickly at that, just to create some backspin, then the ball would be fired and shot through the regular barrel.

I'm still thinking about it, and ways to ameliorate this current situation.

[lvlatt]

paintballs hold too much friction for that....they mught spin, but 5" down the barrel the ball woudl stop spinning again (or spin outta control)

[FlyBoyNZ]

you must hold the marker perfectly upright or the wheel will be angled!!!!!!Creating an angled back spin!!!!!!!! duh!!!

[nlh]

No, incorrect. The ball is held in by the ball latch. The only way it can spin is backwards if there is a counter clockwise force spinning below it. It would not work for frictional and efficiency reasons, not because it required an upright position. Nothing changes in a motorized wheel no matter what position it's set in - it's still circular.

Now, if backspin is added to the ball, no matter what position it's fired at, or in what direction, there is still backspin, in a circular path.

There can not be a true angled backspin on the ball if the wheel and the ball are always in alignment, which they would be.

[FlyBoyNZ]

Look:

[tonysk83]

instead of hiting the ball strait on why no hit the low half of the ball and that will put back spin on it then wiht the wheel that will add back spin.
Heres my drawing bear with me

[nlh]

I see what you're saying now.

However, I think that if the RPM is quick enough, and, considering this is a semi-automatic, the ball has to be spun in one quick action, in a small amount of milliseconds of time, the effects of gravity on an angled marker won't effect it to much. If the spin is done correctly there will be very little noticeable loft - therefore, the balls will not rise if fired at an upright angle - measured from the back.

Hence, when fired at an angle, if the loft is not a noticeable problem, then there will be no problems here. Only distance will be increased.

Aside from this, I would rather use pressurized air to create the backspin, rather than a wheel.

[FlyBoyNZ]

i have an idea to always keep the flatline barrel 90 degrees upright even if the marker is angled. ill post a pic this week.

[nlh]

A kind of rotating device with a weight, so gravity always pulls it to an upright position?

[FlyBoyNZ]

exactly, use ball bearings or something, a weight at the bottom, so it is always in an upright position.

[Shazaam]

Or, as I read on M98center.com. You can put a piece of tape on the top inside the barrel, where the threads are. Masking tape would prolly work best but as soon as the ball hits the tape it creates friction and so...spins the ball, it should work on any barrell.

:drop: