Please Help, Very Irritating

[BushidoFl18]

Where do I begin. I had a response trigger installed into my 98 custom recently. I got to try it out this weekend and wow, I wanted to run the marker over I was so mad. I would fire it for a few shots then the bolt would get stuck, half cocked. Then I would re-cock it, fire some more shots, come out of a bunker, spot the guy, take the shot, and it wouldn't fire cause it was on half cocked. I got shot because if it and I was out. Why is the damn thing doing that? I had a few guys look at it and they couldn't figure it out. Someone mentioned something about the spring, but it looked fine to me. I took it to a pro shop today and had a tech look at it. He fired it and it did the same thing. He took it apart and didn't notice anything wrong. He then noticed the loader I was using. It's the VL Revolution with X board. Fires between 10-12 bps I believe. The r/t fires 15 bps. He said that was causing the bolt to half cock. So he put one of the Halo loaders on it and took it out. Of course it fired fine, but, Is that true? Would the trigger and the loader have anything to do with the bolt half cocking? I didn't think so, but he was the tech. Anyway, I have another loader coming to me. It's the Tippmann Triumph ssl-200. Fires 15 bps. He said that should do the trick. If you guys can help me out or think of something else it might be anything else it might be, please let me know. Yes my marker was well oiled as well. Everything looked fine, the springs, sear, etc. Don't know what it could be.

[PoetVice]

I have a Revy with an x board and nothing like that had ever happened to me. Adjustments can be made turn the tiny screw on the RTs external fitting. If the loader had to do with anything it would be chopping. All the RT does is pushh your trigger finger back for a faster rate of fire. Depending on how you set it, it can shoot bursts as well. You might have it set to burst fire and it only has enough excess gas to leave it half cocked. Also try and test everything with a full tank. Just to eliminate one more possibility. That should help.

[BigTom21]

the only way the loader can cause any problems is if its not feeding fast enough so u are chopping paint at the front bolt then leading to the gun half cocking b/c its all gummed up inside. to help with the friction problem i would suggest polishing the internals of the gun.... it will help it its possibly the rear bolt that is sticking for some reason. does the gun half cock when you are just firing air? are you useing air or CO2? is your linkage arm straight or does it have a little bend in it? these are all little things that can cause the problem you are having..... if someone can think of any other things please add them.

[Corrupted355]

First of all, if you just got the Response trigger, there's no way your finger is going to be trained enough to get 15 bps. Expect no more than 10-12 until you get used to the way it works and you have some practice under your belt. It takes a lot of finesse to get up to 15 bps with a response, and the only way you can get that is with time on the trigger.

Like BigTom said, polishing your internals is going to help out with internal friction a great deal. If your marker is only half cocking, assuming there is no air issue, it's because there is something causing friction to stop it from cocking all the way.

So, like Tom said, take the hopper off and shoot like you would in a game. If it does the same thing it did in the game, it's an air problem. If it doesn't, it could be that your loader isn't fast enough. Are you chopping a lot of paint? If you are, then the paint buildup in the front bolt area is to blame.

In any case, you don't need a Halo. When I was using an Custom Pro-E, I had great results from a Viewloader Evolution. Its cheap and fast enough for your needs (Egg II's are good for 18 bps, Egg III's are good for 22-23). The only real problem is that some people hate how it looks.

[TippmannCCI]

when was the last time u oiled it? mayb ur oil is all gunked up

[PoetVice]

Like everyone else said, Polish your internals. Also re-oil your marker. It may also be how you have your RT trigger set. Havew you tried tweeking it since you bought it? It took me a while to figure it out. I just played with it and made small adjustments. Find out if air is involved or an issue like everyone said too. Like I said before, I used a revy and i had no problems. Heck, I used a gravity hopper and only problem I had was a lot of dry firing. But I've never seen it half cock in my personal experience.

[BushidoFl18]

Yep, I did test it a few times without the hopper, just air and the bolt did not stick. I use compressed air, not co2. I fired it for a long time with just air and it was ok. I did these test with a full tank. If my trigger is set to burst, how do i change that? I didn't even know you could set it to burst. I thought it was all the way you squeeze the trigger. Also, I have tried tweeking and messing around with the trigger adjustment. When I adjusted the trigger for less air, it was really hard to squeeze and it shot about as fast as I could without the trigger. Any faster, like where i had it, it starts chopping balls and the bolt sticks. I did chop some balls and broke a bunch out of the barrel. But when I took it to the pro shop, he cleaned it out for me and it still stuck. So you think I will be ok with the Tippmann Triumph SSL-200 loader? It keeps up at 15bps, vs the VL Revy with x board, if thats even the problem. How do I go about polishing internals? What exactly does that mean and is it expensive? It's like all I wanted to do was make my gun shoot a little faster to keep up out on the field. So I found a good price on the trigger. Then, i nearly lost all the parts to the gun trying to install it myself, so I had to pay to get it installed. Then I had to buy a new loader to keep up with the trigger. Now it's making my bolt stick and now I have to polish my internals. Oh well, the price of the game huh? Thanks for your input. Anything else please let me know.

[bvdave]

if it actually stops half way first thing id do is completely take it apart and clean it, doesnt sound like its the loader at all to me.

clean it up really good, check the springs and everything are ok, check your sear make sure there is no debree,

the thing that catches me is your bolt should be in 1 of 2 places. if its back its because the sear has a hold of it, if not it shoudl be pushed all the way forward by your rear spring. if its only half way then somethings wrong with your spring. or something has seriously jammed up your bolt and its stuck even tho the spring is pushing on it its still not moving back, if you chop enough paint its possible you have lots of paintball shells inside causing problems.


completely clean it out, id say 80% that that alone will fix your problem. if not it may be a spring or damage to the bolt or something else is stopping the bolt (rear)

[BushidoFl18]

Someone else I talked to mentioned the spring. Like I said, I took it to the pro shop and the guy took it apart and looked at it and didn't say anything about the spring. I am leaning more toward that though. I just don't know how to test if it's definitly the spring or not.

[hummerking]

was the ball latch in correctly?

[Coenen]

I'm pretty sure I've got this one, my 98 did this all the time. Get some paint, something hard like, monster balls, and put it through the gun out behind the house or something. When it jams, turn off the loader and flip down the feedneck. I'll bet that you see a ball loaded half way into the breech just sitting there.

What this is symptomatic of is pinching paint, the balls are not getting loaded completely. What's happening though is that when you're pulling the trigger instead of chopping the balls the bolt is pinching them up against the feedport, this jams the marker. The quick solution is to re-cock. The permanent solution is to either fire slower, or get a faster loader.

[MisterMister]

BTW, that "15BPS" claim by Tippmann for the RT? Complete BS. Unless you count shooting a single burst of 3-4 balls... after 3 hours of a master air tech tuning on a chrono... combined with the use of HPA... and... ;)

Seriously though, even with the "Super RT" upgrades & HPA or high end regulator (like the PPS Stabilizer), you will be hard pressed to see 15BPS for more then a few seconds at a time. And thats when you dont have people shooting back at you, allowing for all the time and concentration in the world. As well as a lot of fine tuning on a chrono.

This is why I ditched my RT for an APE e-grip. Well thats one of the reasons anyway. Then you have the fact that you need to retune the RT every time you disassemble the marker to clean it, every time you switch from HPA to C02 or back again, every time you use a significantly different size paintball, etc. etc. etc. among other reasons.

[BushidoFl18]

I'm pretty sure I've got this one, my 98 did this all the time. Get some paint, something hard like, monster balls, and put it through the gun out behind the house or something. When it jams, turn off the loader and flip down the feedneck. I'll bet that you see a ball loaded half way into the breech just sitting there.

What this is symptomatic of is pinching paint, the balls are not getting loaded completely. What's happening though is that when you're pulling the trigger instead of chopping the balls the bolt is pinching them up against the feedport, this jams the marker. The quick solution is to re-cock. The permanent solution is to either fire slower, or get a faster loader.

You are absolutley right. When it happened at the pro shop, the guy left it like that and then took it apart and there was a ball pinched by the breech and the bolt. When it was doing it on the field, and I would re-cock and keep firing, after a few more shots it began breaking and chopping paint. So I have a faster loader coming thats supposed to fire 15bps. Hopefully that will fix the problem, and maybe tuning the trigger down to not fire as fast. We shall see. Any other help you could offer, I would appreciate it. Thanks

[Coenen]

That's kind of what I thought. What's really great is when this happens to you in the middle of a run to bunker someone.

That all sounds about right, pinching isn't going to happen every time, the chances of a chop are much more likely. There's really not a whole lot you can do to help this problem besides a faster loader.

You can drill a couple of holes in the feedneck as vents to prevent blowback gases from pushing balls back up the feedneck. There is also a home made anti-chop mod you can do, CLICK HERE, (http://model98.org/forum/index.php?topic=800.0) I've always wanted to try it but never got around to it.

[BushidoFl18]

Thanks again for your help. Like I said, I hope that new hopper I got today will fix it. If not, I will try the feed neck holes and the anti chop mod you told me bout. Thanks again

[hnasdad]

On my chronograph hand held, 98c with cyclone and r/t, I get 8-10 bps and thats all you should expect. I would be very suprised if you are getting more than ten consistantly, but its possible. If I were you I would get a white towel and lay out your marker. Taking each screw out and placing it near where it went. Take everything apart being careful to watch how things come out. Take your time and take a picture if you have to, but you need to be able to take apart your marker and put it back together. After you have reassembled your marker make sure it works and do it agian. It wont take long for you to start to remember what part goes where. The r/t is a simple modification that you should be able to do yourself. You have the bug or you wouldnt be here and this will not be your last mod. Get to know your baby, It will help you out in the long run. Search polish internals and there is a ton of info. I started out with steel wool until my arm got tired and then used a red scotch brite pad. You are trying to make the parts of your reciever halves smooth that rub on your moving parts of your marker. The front and back bolt. If you have played some with your marker then when you take it apart you will be able to see where it has already rubbed. Clean all that off. Its soft pot metal and overspray so the red scotch brite pad works quickly, not too aggresive. The finish if off with a little steel wool and BAM your cheapest upgrade. Then after you get tired of buying batteries for your hoppers you will get a cyclone. One ball one feed. Just another place to dump more money. Vicious cycle really. Hope that long winded rambling mess helps.

[BushidoFl18]

Lol, Thanks alot for your help as well. You have brought great ideas to my attention.