Outlaw Ball

[MuckRaker]

I've read a number of posts in other forums from people who play "Outlaw Paintball," playing in their yards, woods near their homes, in the street, etc.

Y'alls stories sound cool, but I'm wondering, do y'all chrono the markers, are y'all playing safely, do y'all have the right equipment?

It seems that that kind of play runs the risk of giving paintball a bad name: shooting someone with a hot marker, shooting at exteme close range (most masks are only rated for 280 fps at more than 20 feet).

How do you make sure you're playing a safe game?

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

[Richy_C]

Well no, we dont chrono but we keep the markers under 320, and quit saying y'all! y'all reply this thred, ya hear? lol but we play where a paintball couldn't have a hope of touching someone innocent

[TLplus84]

also masks like JT ones are rated to stand a shotgun that is shot at the lens from near point blank..so i wouldn't worry about a hot marker. If it was only rated to 280 fps at 20 ft..man my eyes would be gone by now..if you use proper equipment...not ski goggles...then you are not in danger.

[PBSouLjAh]

once the velocity of the paintball reaches past da 300fps mark, it is fast enough to break fingers. thats one of the reasons why velocity limits at fields are usually at least 290 or under. anyone play at a field where its 300 or above?? its cuz people dont want people breaking fingers every hand shot. i doubt a JT mask can withstand a shotgun hit from point blank. shotguns can kill bears. but i know jt masks are REALLY durable. f

[elTwitcho]

Well, for one thing, the shotgun thing is true because the masks are shot with small grain BBS, while against a bear you would use slugs. On a side note, all goggles that pass the ASTM safety standards MUST be able to withstand a shot of 400 fps at 5 feet. Since all known paintball goggle systems pass these standards, it's really your fingers you've gotta worry about.

[MuckRaker]

Must be a typo in my JT mask manual. I'll reread it tonight, but I could swear it says "do not shoot the goggles closer than 10 feet at 300 fps." as for being shot in the goggle with a shotgun ... I don't think so, Y'ALL.

[ElectricHead]

i agree with 'ol much, y'all aughta know betters thans ta shoot yer guns with yer fire amrs.

We play "outlaw paintball" around here, but everyone mostly has like rays and weak ****, so only like 3 people out of like 15 have a chance of hurting someone

[MuckRaker]

Hey Man, yew ain't makin' fun of My Suth'n upbring' ere ya?

I like the way you limit the carnage by only have three "real" markers on the field.

[elTwitcho]

no the reason it says not to fire at someone from closer than 10 feet is just because it plain old hurts. most markers will say the same thing, not because it will break the marker to take a hit with such force... it will break the person to take a hit at such force. Even though 300 is supposedly safe for hands, at close range I've seen fingers broken and I've got my pinky in a splint from Monday (not broken, I took a paintball right on the joint past the knuckle and I cant extend my finger all the way, hurts too much). not to mention a goggle hit to the face mask is unpleasant at such close range because that paint shell shrapnel flies through hard and scrapes up your face. It's just too damn unpleasant to be nailed at super close range, and that's why most markers and goggle systems say to be beyond that.

[MuckRaker]

Twitcho, I'd expect more from someone who's chosen Dogbert as an Avatar.

The reason it has those warnings in the book is not because it hurts to get hit. If you've got a mask on you won't feel the hit, right?

Let me quote from the JT manual:

"Even on fields where muzzle velocity is limited to 300 feet per second, the 3 gram paintball is going over 200 miles per hour ... IMMEDIATELY replace any lens that is hit within (10) feet or less even if you can't see damage."

JT doesn't put these warnings in their manual just because it hurts when you get hit. If you're playing so aggressively that you are getting gogged at close range, you run the risk of the lens cracking.

If the worse thing that happened when a player got peppered at 300 fps was that it hurt a little, we wouldn't need masks and goggles.

[ElectricHead]

are thermal lenses stronger than non-thermal?

[MuckRaker]

Not really Electric ... the thermal lenses have two panes with a dead space between them. In theory, if the outer pane gets cracked, you could still play.

[Counterfeit]

No, if the outer lense get cracked you definately should not continue to play. The inner lense is about half as thick as the outer one and is not rated for impact.

[MuckRaker]

I don't know how much a Chrono costs, but it would seem that if you're gonna play outlaw, you at least need a chrono. I really don't have anything against outlaw. It may be that there aren't any fields nearby, or you don't have the money to play on a field. But playing with a hot gun can cause a lot of problems, and it doesn't seem that there's any way to tell if a non-chronoed gun is hot until you get hit.

just my penny's worth.

[MereMoth]

That thing about replacing your lenses everytime you get shot within 10 ft or closer is the biggest bunch of BS I've ever heard. I know JT said it, but it's stupid. I'm not going to replace my lense when it gets shot 10ft or closer. The only time I replace my lense is when it gets scratched up bad.
Who here actually replaces their lense when it gets shot 10ft or closer?

"Spectra™ and Elite™ lenses pass the American ASTM F1776-99 standard, the European EC Directive 89/686/EEC, and the Military MIL-V-43511C @550-560fps. But testing doesnt stop there. We shoot 'em with 20 guage shotguns, stomp 'em,hit 'em with 1/4" steel balls at 400fps, run over 'em, and let the dog chew 'em. We test them to death! And that proves one thing. JT lenses meet an even higher standard - the JT Standard!"

'Nuff said.

[elTwitcho]

BOUYA!

[MuckRaker]

tell ya what Mr. Moth, Mr. Twitcho ... I've got a 12 gauge, some bird shot, send me your masks ... I'll be happy to test them for you, send you the remains back in a plastic bag. i'd be happy to run them over in my Big *** Family Van, send you the lens fragments back. I don't have a dog, but I've got too Rug Rats, I'll let them chew on your mask for a while and see how it holds up.

And when your lens gets an invisible stress fracture from too many gog hits from 10 feet away, and it cracks open, I'll be the one laughing his *** off at y'all.

[TLplus84]

i still think a JT mask can take a shotgun blow..but i still change my goggles once every six months or every time i get shot less than apxmatly 10 feet away. It may be a lot of money, but you really can't put a price on your vision, safety and life can you? If changing a 20 dollar lens once in a while is too much to protect your life....

[ElectricHead]

oh i wouldnt say its life threatening, just really paintfull and you run the risk of losing your eyesight

[TLplus84]

it is life threatening. Losing an eyeball(s) is a very serious thing man. think about it..a paintball hits your goggles at like 300 fps at under 10 ft away. IF it breaks yoru goggles, not only will paint fragments get in your eyes, but nwo you have to worry about shattered lens too. and 300fps is not the speed of a granny walking. it's an extremely fast speed in which it is life threatening. Ask anyone else.

[TLplus84]

it is life threatening. Losing an eyeball(s) is a very serious thing man. think about it..a paintball hits your goggles at like 300 fps at under 10 ft away. IF it breaks yoru goggles, not only will paint fragments get in your eyes, but nwo you have to worry about shattered lens too. and 300fps is not the speed of a granny walking. it's an extremely fast speed in which it is life threatening. Ask anyone else. That's like saying that my magical brownies don't taste unusually good...hahaha

[ElectricHead]

i dont think it would kill you though would it? it seems like your eyelids and eyeballs and face would absorb most of the impact, i dont think anything would get to the vital parts of the brain or whatever

[MuckRaker]

300 feet per second is about 284 miles per hour ... the paintball weighs three grams ... the JT lens is made of Lexan, a polymer slightly tougher than regular plastic. Plus, if you're cleaning your JT lens with Windex, alcohol, ammonia, you're putting chemicals on it that DEGRADE it's strength ... There's alot of STUPID accidents out there waiting to happen.

[TLplus84]

it's not jsut the brain that gets effected..when an eyeball gets shot out...there is also MASSIVE blood loss...and also when you shoot someone...it's not uncommon that you let off a string of shots, so it's not just one paintball that's hitting your exposed face. Like I sed, don't underestimate the speed of paintballs man. it's more dangerous than you think. Some kid in Maryland got shot in the face with a paintball gun and he died.

[Counterfeit]

Originally posted by MuckRaker
300 feet per second is about 284 miles per hour ...

No, 300fps is 200 mph.

[MuckRaker]

As TL pointed out, it's still faster than Grandma walking across the street.

[Richy_C]

goggle skinz are useful when gogged, they prolong lense life and scare the sh!t out of newbies

[TLplus84]

still..i wouldn't keep a lens after being shot that close...call me paranoid but i'd rather have my eye vision and be psycho than to be careless and lazy and then get an eye shot out..and i don't think goggle skinz will help THAT much..

[Richy_C]

i never said they would extend it a long time, at my field, (official) the fps limit is 230 cause it's indoor, so i don't replace lense much, i get hit more on the body in outlaw, more lowspeed gog shots in speed ball

[TLplus84]

yeah thats ok but i'm talking like 300fps+ that is shot within like 10 ft or somethin..ya no? 230 fps is ok and speedball the fps tends to be low too...but owtlaw there is no designated fps regulation..most people crank it and shoot

[Richy_C]

kep in mind that it's usually outside for outlaw ball so he balls slow down A LITTLE BIT

[TLplus84]

true...i guess that what it comes down to is personal preference...people like myself like to change lens' alot...some people like to hold on to that one lens for a year...

[MuckRaker]

makes sense to me to change the lens after successive gog hits, or on a regular basis. I think JT recommends every six months. And I doubt it's so they can make huge profits off people buying lenses twice a year.

[TLplus84]

yeah...that's the thing that i do..close goggle hits or every 6 months. Maybe just MAYBE JT isn't a corporation that only cres about money and actually wants people to be safe and have a good time..heheh

[MuckRaker]

yeah TL, every company is in business to make money ... but ya gotta think about the liability angle also. If they don't post that warning, and someone takes a hit at close range, lens shatters, and player loses eye, that player would end up owning JT. There's a reason for everything beyond profit.

[TLplus84]

oh yeah someone could sue...i never thought of that..good point muck

[MuckRaker]

I wonder if you could sue if the lens didn't shatter ... ;)

A lot of big companies pay big settlements just so they don't have to litigate in court ... Things that make you go HMMMM.

[TLplus84]

hrmm..if it didnt' shatter why would you sue?

[MuckRaker]

for the settlement, of course, you silly boy!!

[TLplus84]

haha isn't that something called FRAUD? :P