Night Vision Goggles

[MuckRaker]

Anyone know anything about night vision goggles ... I'm not interested in buying a set ... I just want to know how to defeat them.

What about infrared scopes?

I thinking about taking this old camera flash I've got, it's a Nikon professional unit I used when I was shooting (film) for a newspaper.

[PB ninja]

You could try something like an infra red flashlight. Basicly like a really strong remote control, night vision will pick up that wavelangth so you could blind them with that without giving away your position to anyone else. Might be kinda' hard to aim though.

[Batman]

Yeah id get the night vision. I always use themin my 24 hour games but you have to find ones that fits over your goggles. IN 24 hour games i am usauly the sniper in 24/7 games and i use my nightvision binos to see around and then pick them off

[Sid]

Hey muck... It depends on what type of night vision you are using. There are three types publicly known: level 1, level 2, and level 3.

Levels 1 and 2 TYPICALLY emitt(emmit?) infrared light in order to construct an image. Level 3 on the other hand TYPICALLY do not emitt any infrared.

Levels 1 and 2 can detect each other. They can both see each others infrared beams like regular eyes can see a flashlight beam.

Since level 3 does not emitt any infrared, levels 1 and 2 cannot pick-up level 3. Level 3 has the ultimate advantage in that it can pick-up, but cannot be detected by the other nightvision systems.

Right now, I don't know how to detect level 3.

[Edited by theflash on 02-04-2001 at 08:34 PM]

[PB ninja]

I don't think muck owns or wants night vision he just wants to burn the retinas of the people who do;).

[Trigger-Happy]

how much would a pair of NVGs cost?

[MuckRaker]

Originally posted by PB ninja
I don't think muck owns or wants night vision he just wants to burn the retinas of the people who do;).

It would seem you've got on to My Devious Little Plan!! :eek:

[TLplus84]

hahaha i could see Muckraker walk up to a guy with Night Vision on and shine a 1,000,000 watt hand held super bright xenon bulb spotlight right in his face..haha :eek:

[Boneyfreak]

level I,II,III refers to sensitivity not how they operate.

It's actually 'Generation I,II,III' get the cheap generation I and you can define objects out to 100mtrs or so ,they all come from former Eastbloc countries , East Germany, former Soviet Union ect. Gen II will define objects out over 100 meters , and GenIII (costing into the thousands) can define object out to hundreds of meters depending upon conditions, these are the units pilots and spec ops use. Of course you can define mtns and large trees ects out way out there. Gen I,II that are affordable pretty much all come from Eastbloc. 'Define' can be translated into being able to positively identify your target as friend or foe 100% of the time at set distance in 'standard' conditions set by the ISOAM. Oh yeah , whether they need external infrared tranmissions or use light intensifying wavelength technology depends on the type of unit not the 'level' or 'generation' of the device.

[Edited by Boneyfreak on 02-02-2001 at 09:00 PM]

[MuckRaker]

Originally posted by TLplus84
hahaha i could see Muckraker walk up to a guy with Night Vision on and shine a 1,000,000 watt hand held super bright xenon bulb spotlight right in his face..haha :eek:

Nothing so humane ... I've got a Huge Arse Nikon Flash for my camera ... It can be set to Rapid Fire, three flashes per second, with fresh batteries it'll shoot like that for about 15 seconds before the capacitor has to recharge. It's several thousand candles, but I'm sure of the Exact strength. or, you can let the charge build and then dump the whole capacitor at once, which is extremely bright. Plus, it has a lens that lets you determine how the light will disperse, either wide angle, or tight telephoto. I think it could wreak havoc on the nite vision folk.

[TLplus84]

LOL with that you won't need night vision and you'll still go blind for a couple seconds :D

[MuckRaker]

I think I could Rapid Flash them to death with it ... Flash, wait a second, do it again, and so on until I'm either out of range, or well hidden or ina good position to strike.

[TLplus84]

LOL now that's a hell of a strategy~ :D

[MuckRaker]

Originally posted by TLplus84
LOL now that's a hell of a strategy~ :D

Slap me if I'm wrong, but if you're using a spotlight or flashlight ... Aren't you giving you're position away. The flash is bright enough, and quick enough, it would screw up, hopefully, everyone's nightvision, and as soon as they get readjusted, flash them again.

[Sid]

Boneyfreak: Opps Gen not lev.. such a big diff.

I stated that Gens 1 and 2 emitt infrared. Sorry, Not EVERY single gen 1 or 2 has an infrared emmitter incorproated. IT IS JUST TYPICAL. I just thought it would be simpler to understand, but if you want to get technical, fine.

There are actually 5 generations of nightvision: Gen 0, Gen 1, Gen 2, Gen 3, And Gen 4. Gen 4's technology is kept private and only available to the military. Gen 3 is not just in the few thousands. They are generally ten times the cost of level 2. The Gallium Arsenide detector surface uses rare elements, which causes the cost to sky rocket.

Heres the descripton of the diff generations:

GEN 0: These were the first NV units produced for military use. They require a full moon (or a searchlight sized infra-red illuminator) and a truck or battleship etc to carry them around. They were not very practical or
effective.

GEN 1: Typically uses an S-20 photocathode, electrostatic inversion and electron acceleration to achieve gain. Because of higher sensitivity than Gen 0, Gen 1 was the first thoroughly passive image intensifier.

These are the most common NVDs on the market

GEN 2: Typically uses an extended red s-20 photocathode and a microchannel plate for gain. Can be found with either electrostatic or fibre optic inversion. Gen 2 units provide superior performance to Gen 1 units but typically cost two to three times as much.


Gen 2+: + Sometimes you find references to a "generation 2+". This is a manufacturer's term for units with an "enhanced second generation tube". The tube uses second generation technology with some (secret) enhancements in order to provide an image superior to standard 2nd generation units (which are still very good) but without the cost of importation restrictions associated with third generation units.

GEN 3: Current US military technology. Uses Gallium Arsenide for the photocathode and a microchannel plate for gain. The microchannel plate is also coated with an ion barrier film to extend the life of the tube. These provide the best performance of all, but typically cost 10 times more and their sale is restricted to government, police or military users.

GEN 4: no idea.

[Keikan]

Target sells a nice Rechargable 2 mil candle power spot light

[Ref]

GEN 3: Current US military technology. Uses Gallium Arsenide for the photocathode and a microchannel plate for gain. The microchannel plate is also coated with an ion barrier film to extend the life of the tube. These provide the best performance of all, but typically cost 10 times more and their sale is restricted to government, police or military users.

What? You can buy those in Cabela's catalog. Hmm..Gen IV is gov only, eh? I wonder why "Big Brother" doesnt want you too see in the dark? Mabye you can see things that you cant normally see..like through Jennifer Lopez's pants! :eek:

http://www.cabelas.com/texis/scripts/store/+/CatalogDisplay/displayPOD/CabFALL1998/CabFALL1998AAANAD/XA969W


[Edited by Ref on 02-16-2001 at 05:44 PM]

[Ref]

What model flash is that Muck? Sounds like you can really burn some eyes is you focus that thing and let all all the built up juice fly!

[Jamez Bond]

The cheapest I've seen them is like $400. The main problem with other people using them- they magnify light. An indiglo watch- if they are that sharp- can screw up your day,( or night). Infa- red is illegal, is'nt it?

[Ref]

Originally posted by Jamez Bond
The cheapest I've seen them is like $400. The main problem with other people using them- they magnify light. An indiglo watch- if they are that sharp- can screw up your day,( or night). Infa- red is illegal, is'nt it?

Illegal? Not that I know of. THe night vision gogles gather and intensify any light source, including infrared light. If you by the infrared "Photon Light" keychain flashlight, you can use it to create more light to see with your nightvision goggles without other people being able to see the light beam.

[RaceFace]

I played with some Night Vision Goggles at a Sportsmen's Classic tradeshow one time. They had the lense caps on with one tiny pinhole in the center of them to allow for the "nightvision experience" in the lighted building. I'm thinking that all you need to do is strap one of those huge maglight flashlights (they come pretty big, you know the kind police officers beat crackheads with) onto your barrel. When you're playing and you see they guy with the Night Vision Goggles, stand up in full view with your gun on him. When he looks up at you click the button on the Maglight (should probobly set it for a narrow beam first) and this should cause his NVGs to flash very bright for as long as you have the spot on him. With any luck, he won't see you well enough (or is just too d*** suprised) to shoot you, and you have the advantage of being able to pick him off while he's illuminated by your light. The only reason I wouldn't use a camera flash is that it won't blind him for very long, and you will also have to hold onto it with one hand while you shoot with the other (unless you can attach it to your gun somehow).

,Happy hunting
<< Race >>

[Jamez Bond]

I would think that to be cheating. We're to cheap to get a set, anyway. And you have to get some that will go over your mask.

[Incube]

How bout you get level 3 NVG`S so you can see the punks that see you who cares about flashy thingys the point is not to let yourself be seen!isnit! also the flash is a bad idea because normal players will see the flash and run to it and shoot you

[Jamez Bond]

True. I don't like a lot of shiny stuff and chrome- too high a signature. Woodland matches have been lost because someone- namely my frien- decided to buy a BLUE raptor custom. Saw him 100 ft. off- he was in full camo. At night- it's harder, but it still reflects what light is out there. A sudden flash of chrome can mean one thing- your enemy is now wearing a new color.

[Ref]

Personally, I wouldn't wear NV's on the field in the first place. It's not like a pair of sunglasses that you can get a replacement lense for if one happens to break (or get shot...).

[Jamez Bond]

That's true- but these things are used in the ARMY, NAVY, S.E.A.L.s, S.W.A.T., AND AIR FORCE! Some have been known to take an AK-47 round and work- on one side!They are made to military spec- they will last. Unless you buy the Wal- Mart all- plastic ones. :)

[Incube]

wall mart?

[Incube]

........wall mart?

[Incube]

....what section in walmart i must look into this.

[Incube]

are you sure about the walmart?

[Incube]

?

[Jamez Bond]

You have to look in sporting goods- they go from $300 to $600. My wal- mart,( Paintball store) has them, but not all might.

[Incube]

oh

[sackerwc]

The Flashing part really wouldn't work cause the ones at the Cabelas online store has automatic high light detection, which would prolly mean that it stops working if to much light goes though them...so a person would't get blind.....

[Incube]

OH OK I THOUGHT THIS THRED WAS DEAD
It may work it depends on the power of the flash.

[Incube]

also i would shot anything that begain to flash anyway

[Jamez Bond]

Good point- I say- Don't cheat- you don't have too. It is probably just as easy to hide in nightvision. All they see is grean- so you you can wear regular camo. And they have a mental idea that they have a huge advantage- And if you have night vision- even better!

[Ref]

And if you have night vision- even better!
It depends. If you have one that sends out infared light, the other people with NV can see you.

[Jamez Bond]

True- but if you can't see where you're shooting- then what's the point?

[Ref]

lol..you didnt get what I was saying..nevermind

[MuckRaker]

Originally posted by sackerwc
The Flashing part really wouldn't work cause the ones at the Cabelas online store has automatic high light detection, which would prolly mean that it stops working if to much light goes though them...so a person would't get blind.....


The point is not to blind the person, but to temporarily disable the nighvision device.

[Ref]

Don't know how you can do that. You can try hitting them with a laser sight. I know it screwed around with digital cameras when you shine them into them.

[MuckRaker]

I've heard that extremely intense light sources will cause some nightvision systems to Flare, like white out, for several seconds. Some people I've talked to say they take high power Q Beam spotlights which also F' with the goggles.

[terpsare1]

wouldn't a laser sight or pointer do the same

[giller]

i have just sent a usless reply to 43 different people lolo wonder how many will check haha

[axi0n]

You can get a Russian Made Gun Mounted Nightvision Scope for the bargain basement price of...

$599.99 Cdn or $413.00 USD...

http://www.fcsurplus.com/spy/details.cgi?Category=spy&Product=760008

Or if you already have weak NV gogs.. you can just get a plain jane emitter / illuminator for $249 cdn... $174.30 cdn

http://www.fcsurplus.com/spy/details.cgi?Category=spy&Product=760009

I'm not sure if these are even good prices.. But you must need to be seriously hardcore to want to drop that kind of coin on a toy you can only use at night...

Whats next... Laser painting target acquisition guns and laser guided smart bombs?

Ax.

Oh ya.. For those who may be local.. The store I am quoting from is Canadian, and is in the London / Forest, Ontario area...

http://www.fcsurplus.com

[Incube]

that thing is huge holy that would weigh your gun down alot abd its to powerful of a lense

[shadow.338]

lol muck, I got one word for ya flashbang... err... maybe its two... aww heck I dunno

[MuckRaker]

EH ... what do i know ... I've never played at night, it was just a idea. :D

[Therand]

I typically play scenario games and have played quite a few night insertions. Here is what I've found:

Night vision - definitely a plus for those players that want to go solo. The major advantage when running with night vision is the ability to sneak up on your enemies. This means that stealth is your prime objective. Either camp out by a frequented area or walk carefully (do not step on fallen branches, etc.). While working in a larger group can achieve larger objectives, its typically not needed. A single camped person can wipe out a whole insertion by being smart and patient. Barrel tags are an easy way to kill people without alerting their friends to your existance (and a whole lot of fun too).

When it comes to NV vs. NV, its paintball as normal. Watch your flank and Kick A.

For those of you thinking about buying night vision and are serious about it, look at the AN-PVS7 series (Gen3). I typically run across those systems. They have a frame for a head mount and will work outside your goggles (if the field requires non-modified goggles). I've heard about the AN-PVS21 series but I haven't actually seen them yet. Has anyone seen them yet? I heard that they can almost fit inside the goggles (roomy goggles that is).

[Pookister569]

night vision is a waste for paintball. why? because they are really expensive and you can easily get them screwed over if you got hit on the night vision.

[iipaintballer]

What about strobe lights? Just keep them on around a base or something that just keeps flashing. If you haev a couple jsut going off. I think that would be too much light for the NVG to be useful

[Chaz]

I dont mean to sound like a wuss or anything,but wont light screw up your eyes if you have night vision goggles on?I have also seen some models that if exposed to light will damage the goggles.That is just something i was thinking and it may not even be true.

[Pookister569]

yeah, most cheap night vision goggles will get screwed up if you look at something too bright. like i said you shouldn't waste your time with them in paintball. they cost too much and you can easily brake em. ...... oh and that strobe light idea is pretty cool. if it was almost pitch black outside and you used it, it would be sweet.

[Mad Ogre]

From first hand experience -
You can defeat NVGs with bright white light.

Little story:
I was wearing wearing NVGs as were others in my squad.
I made the approach to the truck from the front... not the smartest - but thats what my Sarge said. (he was an old Nam vet and I was a PFC and not going to argue) The two guys in the truck were smoking and joking and not paying attention. Turned out that he wanted to check the time on the back lit analog clock... thats when to light the dash - he flicked on the headlights when I was 15 feet in front of them. My NVGs were the starlight variety which amplifies the light...
OMG - I felt like I had red hot needles shoved into my eyes... I fell back and pulled off the goggs and rubbed my eyes... It wasnt fun... It took a long while before I could see again.

Newer NVGs have a flare protection which will negate such light flares... but something a civie would have probably wouldnt. So a bright white light would do the trick.
You dont have to pack a huge spotlight... you can buy the small SUREFIRE 9v tactical lights that put out a great deal of light... those would work just fine.

[Incube]

Originally posted by Mad Ogre
From first hand experience -
You can defeat NVGs with bright white light.

Little story:
I was wearing wearing NVGs as were others in my squad.
I made the approach to the truck from the front... not the smartest - but thats what my Sarge said. (he was an old Nam vet and I was a PFC and not going to argue) The two guys in the truck were smoking and joking and not paying attention. Turned out that he wanted to check the time on the back lit analog clock... thats when to light the dash - he flicked on the headlights when I was 15 feet in front of them. My NVGs were the starlight variety which amplifies the light...
OMG - I felt like I had red hot needles shoved into my eyes... I fell back and pulled off the goggs and rubbed my eyes... It wasnt fun... It took a long while before I could see again.

Newer NVGs have a flare protection which will negate such light flares... but something a civie would have probably wouldnt. So a bright white light would do the trick.
You dont have to pack a huge spotlight... you can buy the small SUREFIRE 9v tactical lights that put out a great deal of light... those would work just fine.
was this a paint ball game or an army war game?