Well... I hate to admit it...

[DasBaldDog]

There is the possibility that I was wrong about mounting the reg on the valve cap.... but it's not final yet....

What's happening is I've got the dwell at around 9 ms... Flo pressure at around 240 and my FGP pressure around 160 or so...

First shot = good
Second shot = good
Third = low
Fourth = even lower...

Possibly the air being sucked away from the reg...

Is there such a thing as high flow cocker hose?

Also, those of you who know LPR's... does the settings I've got sound about right?

[DasBaldDog]

FOM.... I'm looking in your direction here....

Also, a second problem, this one more recent.....

I fire the gun (with or without LPR) and I hear some type of noise.... sounds like it's comming from the hammer-ish area and it sounds like metal straining mixed with a balloon blowing up.... I've clean and greased EVERYTHING and still it comes back after about 10 shots.

[mipaint]

Well ofcourse the first question is "What Reg?"

If it looks like the one I pictured below-- put it on a cocker and get rid of it-- they simply are not suitable for Impulses

Setting it up...

I know there have been a LOT of people claiming all sorts of wonderus things about LPRs and offering all sorts of advice on the set up-- and many of these fokes have had experince with only 1 or 2 regs.

Hear is the best way to get the best STARTING POINT. But it is a lot of work.

set the gun at 200

adjust the LPR so it is at "high pressure" (most screw in to increese pressure, but this may varry with the reg you are using)

now shoot over a chrno.

I don't care how high the speed is for the moment- I'm only concerned with how it changes with dwell adjustment.

what you are going to do is shoot a couple, INCREESE dwell and shoot a couple more. At first, you should get a sizeable increese in speed when you increese the dwell. at some point, you will get almost no increese in spped with aditional dwell. What we are trying to find is the upper limit of dwell that will still resul in a marked increese in veloicity.

When you hit the "no change" point, back it off slighty (you should see a drop in veloicity) and use this as your "correct" dwell setting.

now adjust your LPR to get the veloicity you want. Asuming there is nothing wrong with your LPR (or type of LPR) you should get great consistency and no shoot down (even with the lpr on the front cap)

Now as I stated before- this is a great STARTING POINT You will no doubt want to try different input pressures (and corrasponding adjustments in LPR setting) to get whats "right for you".

Ofcourse you can screw with different dwell settings- but this give you a point to come back to when things become FUBAR.

Hope this helps!

FOM

[DasBaldDog]

I have 3 regs at my disposal....

Shocktech FGP

WGP Tickler

WGP Jackhammer (stock cocker reg)


What about the hose? This hose seems to have a smaller diameter than most cocker hoses I've worked with in the past.

Is there a break in period with these things?


Thanks for your help FOM

[mipaint]

I'd try the tickler first-- I have had good experinces with those. you may not have the pressure range you need with the stock reg - ofcourse if you know how to shim it, that is not an issue

I have never tried the shocktech- logic says it should be good, just no experince with them

FOM

[DasBaldDog]

Okay....

Another 2 small questions...

I'm told that springs may make a difference....

I have a long kind of dark spring (stock spring) and I have a shorter silver spring that came with some Eclipse stuff I have. Which one do you think is better....

Second question, this one has great importance.... Say for some reason I blew the solenoid, what would happen.... I mean how would I know?

I ask because I've got a small jet of air coming from the solenoid tray hitting my hand everytime I fire.... I don't think the sol blew though because the gun will still cycle.

[splatterpunx]

on the shock LPR,i think it was FOM that told me about a different angle to look at the LPR thing,that the problems
are because of the pressure differences and how high your running the LPR on the impulse

the shock reg is a great performer ive had no problems with them but they are specifically made to function at low lpr pressures 70 and below

it could be that that is the hinderence


i agree that the tickler is going to be a good place to start
the tickler runs at higher cocking pressures better

[dynorock1]

Das, when you say there is a possiblility that you could have been wrong about mounting on the valve cap... what do you mean? are you sayin you mounted your lpr on the valve cap and you think that is why you are having problems?

[DasBaldDog]

Perhaps.... I don't know really....

I was under the impression (and still am) that one of the main fuctions of the LPR is so that you can lower your dwell and increase efficiency....

At this point, my dwell is HIGHER than without the LPR running the same fps.

[mipaint]

If you had blowen the solonoid, you would have a constent air leak-- what you are feeling is just the "exaust
gas"-- sorta like the bit of air that is vented out the taped hole on the shocker. (the Impulse has no "exaust port"- so the exaust gas from the solonoid is just vented into the tray.

I'm betting you will see no difference between the springs. But try this-- put each spring in the valve and push forward on the bolt. (you know the last 1/8 inch or so where you feel the spring of the valve) which ever one feels lightest is the one to use. Note that the shortest spring MAY NOT be the lightest.

The dwell thing is another story. Most fokes think the dwell directly relates to the time the valve is open. this is not the case. the hammer "bounces" the valve off its seat. In almost all settings, the hammer loses contact with the valve for a very short bit of time. We tend to simplfiy "dwell" by saying that 9ms of dwell keeps the valve open for 9 ms. That is not neccesarly true. now when we use a lower pressure on the hammer (solnoid pressure) the hammer has to work harder to get the valve open. If you know a bit about cams on cars, what we are getting with a LPR set up is a "short duration high lift cam" basicly we are trying to knock the valve open a bit futher.

This is futher complacated by the guys that run with no valve springs. The theroy is that the no spring assembly is easier to open- well its not the spring that keeps the valve shut- its the 200 psi of air behind it that keeps it shut. The spring is there just to give a bit more controled closing. In effect the no spring valve has to wait to be "sucked closed" while the valve with spring has a more defined closing. I have seen many a person running combinations of lpr, high pressure differinal, and no spring talking about very short dwell settings. the problem is because you hae to wait for the valve to be "sucked" closed- you are efectivly makeing your dwell longer. It is also effectivly retarding your closing- a bit like having more overlap on a highpreformance cam.

I know all of the above is a bunch of theory crap, but it is important to realize that we are not dealing with a on/off switch. we contune to flow gas to the valve AFTER the dwell is off- some combinations will flow air longer then others- but it is the combination- not just the dwell time that gives the result. and every gun is enought different that there is simply no "right" setting for all guns.

Once you accept the fact that the dwell is not a simple on/off switch for the air going to the bolt, hopefuly you will understand that the length of the dwell is not directly related to gas effecincy. the only time it is directly related is when all other factors are equal

so I hope I confused everone enought now- I'll shut up and leave

FOM

[DasBaldDog]

Actually....

I found that to be quite entertaining if not a bit long winded.

If your goal was to explain the exact concept of dwell in Impulses to me, you succeeded.

[The Legend]

The FGP works fine, keep it.

How fast are you shooting rof wise when this happens? A good cleaning/greasing of the fgp might help. (There's only two orings, they're all 2 piece regs, lube it up).

Remove your valve spring(or use the short one), set your pressure to 200-230, adjust dwell a click lower than you had it, and adjust velocity with the lpr.

[dynorock1]

Hey Das,

Hows the LPR setup goin? Thinkin about ordering the kit from epbo, and want to know if you've been able to get yours set up yet?

If a mod isnt able to get it set up well, i might have some doubts about myself gettin right, but i hope ill be able to figure it out.

[DasBaldDog]

I haven't had much time to be able to try and set it up recently......

With school, work, house and all the other stuff I have to do.... the LPR must wait...