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Old 02-01-2006, 12:26 PM   #2
Uziel Gal
Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Chingford, London, UK
Can I use Nitrous Oxide tanks from a car supercharger on an air system?

As stated at the beginning, this forum deals with air systems that have been tested for paintball use, and cannot confirm the suitability of tanks intended for use in other applications. As such, these tanks cannot be and should not be recommended for use in paintball applications unless the DOT and bottle manufacture confirm that they are suitable.

Can I fill a large Propane tank with CO2 and use it to fill my CO2 bottles?

As above, you are using a tank for a purpose it was not intended for and with a different gas. This cannot be condoned and should not be attempted or recommended unless the manufacturer and the DOT state that it is safe to do so. It is also entirely possible that the tank will have different valving that will not allow for the use of a commercial fill station, and may not be fitted with a syphon tube, so you would have to turn the tank upside down to get a liquid fill in to your bottle. With the potential this has for the tank to be dropped, this is another practice that isn’t advisable.

Hire a CO2 cylinder with a syphon tube installed, they don’t cost that much, and use a commercially available fill station.

A brief look at valve installation: -

I don’t intend to get in to a detailed description of valve installation procedures, as you should not be attempting this yourself if you do not know the correct procedure. If you do not know how to do this safely yourself, leave it to an experienced airsmith at shop or field.

What I wish to discuss is the use of Loctite during valve installation, or more importantly, not using it.

The use of high strength Loctite threadlocker, product code 262 or 271 (often referred to as “red Loctite”) is often suggested when installing valves. While this makes the separation of the valve from the bottle highly unlikely, it’s use is actually a bad idea. High strength threadlock is intended for use on permanent or at least semi-permanent installation, where the parts are seldom if ever expected to be taken apart. Unfortunately, this is not the case with air systems, which require the valve to be removed for hydrotesting or air travel, and in some cases, need to be removed from the bottle for servicing. Separating parts held together with this product requires excessive force, or the use of heat to soften the threadlock. The bond is in fact so strong, that it can remove particles of metal from the bottle and valve threads when the parts are separated by force. This can weaken the threads, and increases the likelihood of the threads failing with each successive assembly and disassembly. Obviously, heating the Loctite bond to weaken it is not an option, as this can effect the structural integrity of the bottle.

As such, the use of high strength Loctite threadlock cannot be recommended. If you absolutely insist on the use of a threadlock, use a removable strength one such as Loctite product codes 222, 242 or 243. Loctite threadlocker 242 is often referred to as “blue Loctite” – it isn’t actually very helpful to identify Loctite products by colour, as a lot of their products are either blue or red, most of their products are not threadlockers, and blue and red do not necessarily refer respectively to weak and strong throughout their product range. To get the product you need, it is best to refer to the product by the code number. A removable strength Loctite is much less likely to damage the threads of you air system, and should not require heating to remove it.

The o-ring between the valve and the bottle should seal the joint. Loctite is not required to make a seal. If the joint leaks, replace the o-ring.

Loctite is also not required to stop the valve separating from the bottle. This can be accomplished purely through torque. A preset regulator or CO2 valve should be installed with enough torque that the bottle and valve cannot be separated by hand strength alone, so the bottle cannot be accidentally unscrewed from the valve where the valve to get stuck in the marker’s ASA. The level of torque used during the installation has to be high enough to ensure that the valve and bottle cannot be separated without the use of tools. That way, the bottle cannot come apart unless it is being intentionally disassembled.
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Last edited by Uziel Gal : 02-11-2006 at 06:54 PM.
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