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Old 04-20-2004, 06:28 PM   #41
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You guys are absolutely mistaken about 3a. ^^Any barrel can chop balls! Was it a Spyder? I was chopping balls left and right when I had a Dye barrel on my spyder. It doesn't have to be the barrel.

Also, you guys have no backup whatsoever to any of your claims.

The regulators on 3A tanks are CENTERFLAG and the tanks are LUXFER or another known company. They have 99% Positive feedback on their ebay account. Many positives said something along the lines of "great product."

EVERY person that actually owned a 3A product that I heard from said it was good. I have seen NOBODY who owns a 3A product call it bad. None of you own any products, so how can you begin to judge? You have no backup to your arguments.

Their tanks go brand new about 190 for an 88/4500 (30 less than Dye of equivalent size). Who said anything about cheap? Oh by the way, they also sell plain tanks without the graphics.

I agree that whatever happened a while ago was wrong, but you cannot judge an entire company and it's line of products based on one incident a long time ago.

3A is a new company. Like many other new companies, they need to build a reputation. Even though they made some mistakes, we should quit being such jerks and let them succeed.

Do you want paintball to grow? We need to support new companies.

No I am not working for 3a. I just won my 88/4500 tank off ebay.

Are you aware that there is an online petition to have 3a put back onto this site?
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Old 04-20-2004, 07:21 PM   #42
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well i guess that 3A barrel my friend bought was not REALLY CROOKED, it must have been some wierd optical illusion......
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Old 04-20-2004, 07:32 PM   #43
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this should really shed some light IMO.

Quote:
Originally posted by Nitto
Terrible company. They false advertise on e-bay and somehow get away with it.
If you leave them negative feedback because they screwed the pooch, they will leave you negative feedback and try to make it look like your fault.
Now they email me and asked me to withdraw my negative feedback ROFLOL!

From Me:
I followed your instructions and paid you according to your terms. How did I not follow instructions?You posted a picture of a tank with graffiti on it and did not specify that it was a generic tank, with a seperate cheap sticker,that came seperatly and they were even creased! That according to e-bay is fraud and misrepresentation unless stated in the ad that the picture varies from said product.


Their answer:


We would like to notify you that according to the new eBay rules,
both trading partners are able to resolve the problems with the
negative feedbacks in a more rational way.
That means that if both members agree, the negative feedbacks left
by both of the parties will be mutually withdrawn at the same time.
We are kindly asking you to take advantage of these new rules and
to mutually withdraw the negatives we have both left to each
other.
We are sure that your member profile is as important as it is for us.
Please, take into consideration our offer and contact us if you
think that our proposal is appropriate.

Best regards,
Team

Thank you,
3a-wholesale
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Old 04-21-2004, 04:00 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by aznpsycho
well i guess that 3A barrel my friend bought was not REALLY CROOKED, it must have been some wierd optical illusion......

o yours too? YA it choped paint in 3 different guns.....1 gun, ok. But when its bad on 3 guns....there might just be sumthin wrong with the barrel.

Firemoth....there tanks from what i hear arnt the greatest and hell u can get a 72ci 3k for 110 new and it will be cheaper still but it also works well(+great customer service)!

And they things they did were wrong and im startin to think maybe there are sum kinda fraud laws they have infringed on
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Old 04-21-2004, 05:58 AM   #45
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you win some and you lose some...can't please everyone. I have had a tank and a couple other items from them and I haven't had any problems with them. I asked them a few questions and got quick responses and was very satisfied by the customer service rep I delt with. So they screwed up in January 2003....it has been well over a year people, they are growing and coming out with more products so they must be doing something right. I just dont understand why people always hate the new companies that come out in paintball. Some of you may remember the same crap happening with Ronin, System X (before they made guns and after), Nitro Duck, Gen X, etc...
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Old 04-21-2004, 09:32 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by firemoth
You guys are absolutely mistaken about 3a. ^^Any barrel can chop balls! Was it a Spyder? I was chopping balls left and right when I had a Dye barrel on my spyder. It doesn't have to be the barrel.

Actually no barrel can chop. That would be the breach.

Also, you guys have no backup whatsoever to any of your claims.

I would think the kids holding the brand new BENT barrels and the LEAKY tanks would have some back up. Unless of coarse they're just imagining things and that really isn't a leak or bend

The regulators on 3A tanks are CENTERFLAG and the tanks are LUXFER or another known company. They have 99% Positive feedback on their ebay account. Many positives said something along the lines of "great product."

ya' those are good brownie recipes. Makes very sweet and cakey brownies...

EVERY person that actually owned a 3A product that I heard from said it was good. I have seen NOBODY who owns a 3A product call it bad. None of you own any products, so how can you begin to judge? You have no backup to your arguments.

covered this already. Look a little harder. It won't be tough to find unhappy customers. The big reason why they might not hear from unhappy customers is because they hang up on you when you complain and when you try to reach someone on the forum and dis their product you get banned. Happened to me twice so don't tell me it didn't

Their tanks go brand new about 190 for an 88/4500 (30 less than Dye of equivalent size). Who said anything about cheap? Oh by the way, they also sell plain tanks without the graphics.

most tanks are cheaper then Dye's and that price isn't too far off from any other 88/45.

I agree that whatever happened a while ago was wrong, but you cannot judge an entire company and it's line of products based on one incident a long time ago.
um...try multiple incidents over the first year of them being in business and it STILL continues today.

3A is a new company. Like many other new companies, they need to build a reputation. Even though they made some mistakes, we should quit being such jerks and let them succeed.

WE'RE jerks?! Gee I guess they shouldn't have shot themselves in the foot by lying to people and bumping the rating one their products. When a NEW company does that what kind of rep do you think they're going to get. At that moment they built their rep. It take a while to build trust. It takes a second to destroy it. They made they're bed. Time to lay in it.

Do you want paintball to grow? We need to support new companies.
Of coarse we do. Dumb question IMO. Sorry. You've got that backwards though. WE don't have to do anything. Without us they're nothing and don't exist. They provide for us and we buy if we like. Personally, I will NEVER support any company that lied to me. Period. They had their chance and blew it. Paintball needs honest players and companies for the growth of paintball. 3A doesn't exactly fit the profile does it.

No I am not working for 3a. I just won my 88/4500 tank off ebay.
I honestly wish you the best of luck with it and I hope it never fails you. I mean that, no BS. Congrats on the win.

Are you aware that there is an online petition to have 3a put back onto this site?
They were banned from here for breaking the rules of the site. They agreed to these rules upon registering here. This site and/or it's administrators are under no obligation to acknowledge them now and can not be forced to allow them to return because they were rightfully banned in the first place. They can petition all they want. This is a privately owned site. The Admin has final say on who comes and who goes. The petition is completely irrelevant and useless. A million people could sign it along with the President, the Pope, and God and Admin(s) can still say no and no one can can do a damn thing about it.
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Last edited by Jaster : 04-21-2004 at 10:10 AM.
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Old 04-21-2004, 10:44 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally posted by firemoth
Are you aware that there is an online petition to have 3a put back onto this site?
http://www.e-evil.com/paintball.php

The top article. This is your language warning, right here.

Jaster:
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Old 04-21-2004, 11:18 AM   #48
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I simply mentioned there was an online petition. I do not support it or dislike it, I simply mentioned it was there. Yeah, I agree they are useless and theres no point.

Jaster, they have a total of 25 feedbacks from the brownie recipies out of thousands. All the feedbacks I looked at are 3A paintball equipment. I purposely scrolled through many pages of their feedback, and looked at many items the feedback was left for, and have not found any legitamate negative feedback.

Also, my point in the other statement was not that they manufacture cheap products, but the fact they their prices are comparable to other manufacturers.

I still have NOT heard from ANYONE who owns a 3A product complain about it. No, "my friend" is not a first hand account. Show me some bad reviews! I seriously want to see them. I did many Google searches and came up with nothing. Of course, that isn't helped by the fact that they aren't on this site.

3A barrels are not the only barrels succeptible to being bent. Their equipment is manufactured to the same standards as other companies. I don't think there would be such high demand for their things on ebay if they had a bad record.

I have heard only good things about their products first-hand, and also good things about their customer service. I personally do not understand how stupid they could get and do what they did here on PBR. I completely agree with you guys about that issue. However, it has nothing to do with the quality of their products. Hell, it could have been one person from the company doing it all, and they could have been fired over it. It could just be a big misunderstanding.

^^ mlk3454 is an example I agree with.

Last edited by firemoth : 04-21-2004 at 11:30 AM.
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Old 04-21-2004, 01:07 PM   #49
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Props Jaster

That takes my post i was gona put up to the next level...your So much greater than I
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Old 04-21-2004, 01:28 PM   #50
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Wow some of you guys really are set on your opinions and your not moving at all...

I will post here with results after I get my tank.
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Old 04-21-2004, 02:07 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by firemoth
Wow some of you guys really are set on your opinions and your not moving at all...
3a could have the best, cheapest product in the world, but because of what they did here at PBReview, I will never buy from them. To me, a company being trustworthy is the most important factor. I understand that they were trying to earn a good reputation by writing glowing reviews for them self, but fact is it is still wrong. If they would have admitted what they did when confronted, I may have liked them. But the truth of the matter is they denied it. Even when outstanding evidence was shown. I would not support such a company, no matter how good their products are.

Your right, I don't own any 3a stuff, and it's for a good reason. I have tested their stuff from many of my friends. From what I've used and seen (and I have used a lot of their stuff), I have concluded that their stuff in poor quality. Maybe I'm right, maybe their stuff is crap. Maybe your right, maybe most of their stuff is good and I happened to test a bunch of lemons. But I'd rather buy from a reputable company that I know has quality stuff instead of taking a chance. And quite frankly I could careless if you believed me if these "friends" are real or not.

The bottomline here is, 3a paintball broke the PBReview rules. It is no different than if a member broke the forum rules and got banned. They broke the rules, they were even confronted and given a second chance, but they lied and tried to get around it. Because of this they are banned from PBReview.
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Old 04-21-2004, 03:36 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by Calebd2


3a could have the best, cheapest product in the world, but because of what they did here at PBReview, I will never buy from them. To me, a company being trustworthy is the most important factor. I understand that they were trying to earn a good reputation by writing glowing reviews for them self, but fact is it is still wrong. If they would have admitted what they did when confronted, I may have liked them. But the truth of the matter is they denied it. Even when outstanding evidence was shown. I would not support such a company, no matter how good their products are.

Your right, I don't own any 3a stuff, and it's for a good reason. I have tested their stuff from many of my friends. From what I've used and seen (and I have used a lot of their stuff), I have concluded that their stuff in poor quality. Maybe I'm right, maybe their stuff is crap. Maybe your right, maybe most of their stuff is good and I happened to test a bunch of lemons. But I'd rather buy from a reputable company that I know has quality stuff instead of taking a chance. And quite frankly I could careless if you believed me if these "friends" are real or not.

The bottomline here is, 3a paintball broke the PBReview rules. It is no different than if a member broke the forum rules and got banned. They broke the rules, they were even confronted and given a second chance, but they lied and tried to get around it. Because of this they are banned from PBReview.
Fair enough I guess.

But I'm just curious, how much and what kind of proof did you guys get about them reviewing themselves? Is it possible it was a misunderstanding?

You know what, I'll send them a kind email asking about this and see how they will respond.
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Old 04-21-2004, 03:51 PM   #53
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you can track ip's and then match them up w/ 3a reps's ip's
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Old 04-21-2004, 03:59 PM   #54
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if I remember right, caleeb or one of the other mods can correct me if I am wrong, but there were ip matches and that is what got them "caught." I did write a review before they were booted though and mine along with theirs and the others were thrown out. Does suck that a product can't be represented in a big review place but rules are rules...oh and I did have a review for my old impy and that one was deleted for some odd reason as well...
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Old 04-22-2004, 10:52 AM   #55
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If you werent the buyer on e-bay how could you tell if it was legitamate?
If you spent your money on something that was falsely advertised or you had issues in any way with them that you did not feel was right, I suppose you would give them positive feedback?
No say a person left them negative feedback for a legit reason, why would 3a feel the need to retaliate with negative feedback for the buyer,after it was proven not to be the buyers fault?
They send negative feedback in retaliation- pure and simple, go look at every negative or neutral feedback they had and see what they left for the buyer....it's pathetic.



Quote:
Originally posted by firemoth
Jaster, they have a total of 25 feedbacks from the brownie recipies out of thousands. All the feedbacks I looked at are 3A paintball equipment. I purposely scrolled through many pages of their feedback, and looked at many items the feedback was left for, and have not found any legitamate negative feedback.
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Old 04-22-2004, 11:28 AM   #56
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This is the result of my email to 3A. Their reply is on top, my message is underneath it.


From : <info@3a-paintball.com>
Sent : Thursday, April 22, 2004 12:04 PM
To : *****
Subject : Fw: The pbreview issue

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Hello

After the first experience we had with Pb Review we are not interested to be
listed in Pb Review.
Yes we posted good reviews, but only because one guy started to leave very
very negative reviews that had no sense. Reviews saying that he had a tank
that had exploded etc...
This guy left 4 or 5 reviews one after the other. Not only this was not
true, but was clearly an attack against us.
We contacted Pb Review, and they didn't do anything when it was clearly
unfair.
We started posting reviews until they blocked us.

We are much more happy banned. We believe our products speak by themselves.
If we have bad reputation, fine. We never sold as much as now, and we know
most people get our products love them, never mind what is being said in
Pb review forum....

A lot of manufacturers and distributors clearly feel danger from us and our
policy. We basicaly sell same products as there's 25 to 50% cheaper. They
are the first ones to speak bad about our products. We now have been selling
our tanks with Center Flag regs for more then a year and they still say the
regs are crap... fine. This is because they know we sell more then 1000
systems per month . probably more then what they sell in a year.

Really, lets stay out of PbReview. I love personaly Pb Review but I believe
that the moderators there are friends with for example crossfire or other
companies and they will never accept we kill there business.

Sincerely
Franck
Sales Manager

----- Original Message -----
From: <wholesale@3a-paintball.com>
To: <info@3a-paintball.com>
Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 3:29 AM
Subject: FW: The pbreview issue


>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ****
> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 4:52 PM
> To: wholesale@3a-paintball.com
> Subject: The pbreview issue
>
> Hello,
>
> I am emailing to find out about the issue of pbreview banning all of your
> products from being reviewed on their website. For the record, I recently
> bought a tank from you guys.
>
> As you may know, www.pbreview.com is a major website that operates to help
> players in finding out about products in the paintball industry. It
allows
> users to post reviews on just about anything paintball related, and helps
> players with purchasing decisions.
>
> Some time ago, 3A products were listed among the products that were
> reviewable. However, an issue came up that caused all 3A products to be
> removed from the site, and to make it against the rules to even talk about
> 3A products. Apparently, representatives from 3A paintball started
posting
> positive reviews for all of their own products, and when asked about this,
> 3A denied it completely.
>
> I would like an explanation of this, on behalf of myself and all of
> Pbreview. Because of this, your company has earned a very bad reputation.
> This may be your chance to redeem yourselves. We just want an
explanation.
>
> Was it a misunderstanding? Why was it denied?
>
> I am awaiting a response.
>
> Thank You,
> Nick S.
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Old 04-22-2004, 11:34 AM   #57
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So basically he is saying that they posted reviews because somebody else kept posting bad reviews that were extreme and untrue and Pbreview did nothing about it.

He also says that a motive behind the bannings is that Pbreview is connected to other manufacturers (which I know probably isn't true).

Notice he admits to his wrongdoings.

Was this before Pbreview implemented the system of filtering out/reporting reviews, and registering before posting?

So what do you think?

Last edited by firemoth : 04-22-2004 at 11:38 AM.
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Old 04-22-2004, 11:35 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nitto
They send negative feedback in retaliation- pure and simple, go look at every negative or neutral feedback they had and see what they left for the buyer....it's pathetic.
I love there responses, it's quite funny.

"Buyer: it was not that fast shipping and also dosen't comunicate alot with you...
Reply by 3a-wholesale: ITEM SHIPPED NEXT DAY AFTER RECV PAY..BAD BUYER!.. DOESN'T KNOW HOW EBAY WORKS. "

In a bad mood today?

"Reply by 3a-wholesale: This is senseless!!!
Reply by 3a-wholesale: Shipping mistakes are possible.
Reply by 3a-wholesale: Why Complains????????This is ridiculous!!!!!!!!!!! "

Funny stuff...
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Old 04-22-2004, 11:42 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally posted by firemoth
Notice he admits to his wrongdoings.

Was this before Pbreview implemented the system of filtering out/reporting reviews, and registering before posting?
To bad he didn't admit is wrongdoings back when they were confronted.

This was before the review moderators, if that is what you are talking about.

Friends with other companies?? Mmmm, no. I wish I was fortunate enough to have friend in high places.

And personally, I see MANY more crossfire/centerflag/and other brands at my field than others.

Whatever, it doesn't really matter. If they are doing well off with their business, great for them.
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Old 04-22-2004, 11:43 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally posted by Calebd2


I love there responses, it's quite funny.

"Buyer: it was not that fast shipping and also dosen't comunicate alot with you...
Reply by 3a-wholesale: ITEM SHIPPED NEXT DAY AFTER RECV PAY..BAD BUYER!.. DOESN'T KNOW HOW EBAY WORKS. "

In a bad mood today?

"Reply by 3a-wholesale: This is senseless!!!
Reply by 3a-wholesale: Shipping mistakes are possible.
Reply by 3a-wholesale: Why Complains????????This is ridiculous!!!!!!!!!!! "

Funny stuff...
Yeah one has to wonder if the guy is from another country or something...the grammar in his emails was all wierd too..

but anyways, the negatives left WERE for stupid reasons. If somebody left a negative saying "I am trying to pay for my barrel but my Paypal isn't working," (real one) I would be angry too and retaliate.
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