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Old 11-10-2005, 03:23 PM   #1
Opteron_FA
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Poorman's Barrel

Dunno if this has been brought up before... but I decided today to mess around with one of my spyder stock barrels that I have from previous spyders, I choose the E-99 the one with the Muzzle Break and Porting. What I did was took a pipe cutter and cut off the muzzle break part, about 1 inch from the top. I sanded down the rough edges and gave it a test. I wouldn't belive my eyes! My stock barrel was shooting more accurate than my 2 piece CP barrel! I had much tighter groupings, they would have a spread of about 6inches, compared to 1ft+ that my CP barrel had. Tests may vary from barrel to barrel, I did 3 tests with both barrels.

Now for the pictures:
Before
How the Barrel looked like

After:


Muzzle Break I cut off:


How end of barrel looks after cut and sanding down rough edges:


If you have any questions feel free to ask me.
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Old 11-10-2005, 03:56 PM   #2
snotshooter
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I like! All that porting at the end is supposta do anyway is reduce sound, and If you dont mind AND your accuracy is 50% better. Hurrah.
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Old 11-10-2005, 04:15 PM   #3
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It actually made it quieter and improved accuracy, I don't believe it myself but it works!
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Old 11-10-2005, 06:23 PM   #4
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can you please give some more detailed instructions? i'm quite new to the home ghetto modding and i'm interested in trying this... so all i do is cut off the part you're holdin up in the second picture, sand down the cut end of my barrel, and then thats it?
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Old 11-10-2005, 06:28 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrothyOmen
can you please give some more detailed instructions? i'm quite new to the home ghetto modding and i'm interested in trying this...
look for the 'shorty barrel' mod in my tech section for more details.
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Old 11-10-2005, 07:58 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sundragonpps
look for the 'shorty barrel' mod in my tech section for more details.
ty sundragon
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:41 PM   #7
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I have a few stock barrels laying around maybe I'll try this. Sounds like something fun to do. Maybe I'll go for like a 3" barrel just in case I want to play tight... really tight.
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Old 11-10-2005, 10:38 PM   #8
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yea, its been brought up before, but im always glad to see people using their heads.

did it really improve performance though? it shouldn't have, but hey, things that shouldn't happen happen all the time, right?
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Old 11-11-2005, 04:25 AM   #9
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Yea, I didn't believe it my self but it greatly improved accuracy, I was totally shocked with the results.
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Old 11-11-2005, 09:06 AM   #10
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Lightbulb Porting improves accuracy - a fresh perspective

Porting may have improved performance for a couple of reasons. Keep reading.

Ask yourself: why does porting reduce sound?

Answer: because it directs sound, which is essentially vibrating air, out the side of the barrel instead of out the front - the sound goes sideways instead of toward your opponent, making it seem quieter to them. Therefore, it stands to reason that if you have excessive air around your ball, caused by too big a bore for the size paintball you're using, it may be manipulating the ball as it leaves the barrel. By the air escaping out the porting holes, the ball has less air "manipulation" as it leaves the muzzle. This is why the Smart Parts Freak barrel insert system is so damn good, and it's why I purchased it. While not cheap, you slip inserts that match the size ball you're using so excess air doesn't surround the ball and manipulate its tragectory as it leaves the barrel.

Also, porting may actually cause the ball to spin. As with my All American barrel front (attaches to the Freak rear with the insert), the air escapes the porting, which is arranged in a spiral pattern. This air escaping in a spiral pattern will cause the ball to spin, creating a "rifling" effect similar to a real rifle. Anyone will tell you rifling makes a bullet more accurate. The Smart Parts Freak system suggests this behavior, so I didn't pull this out of my butt.

Does this seem reasonable to anyone, or am I just spouting? lol

In this situation, the muzzle break may have been hurting you because too much air was escaping right at the end of the barrel, another issue that does the opposite to the ball. If too much air is escaping, the ball is going to lose speed, and potentially lose accuracy. Now, with the break off, your ball may be leaving the barrel at a higher speed, and since the basic porting is there, it might be affecting the ball more positively than negatively. Muzzle breaks on rifles reduce sound and kick, but that's it - you will lose bullet speed on any gun with a muzzle break. Hmmm...just wondering how this works because it's cool to brainstorm.

Last edited by BTRobertson : 11-11-2005 at 09:14 AM.
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Old 11-11-2005, 12:16 PM   #11
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this isn't quite right. First, you are right that a too loose fit does cause bad accuracy by the air rushing past the ball. The ball goes to one side in that situation, and rolls out the barrel, inducing a spin that makes it hook. So that part is right.
The muzzle break is designed to improve accuracy by venting the pressure away from behind the ball just before it exits. The reason this helps is because just as the ball exits all the pressure behind it starts to blow out sideways. The same happens in firearms too, which is why a quality barrel crown is so important. A paintball will usually not fit a barrel well enough to make this even blowout happen, so the muzzle break is there to make it a non-issue. If the accuracy of this barrel improved by removing it, then I'd bet there was something wrong with the brake.
Spiral porting does not induce spin. It cannot induce spin and never will. All American barrels are accurate because they are slick on the inside and because of the dual bore. They are quiet because of the porting, which helps just a little with accuracy.
Here's a theory about why your mod helped: perhaps you crushed the end of the barrel just a little with the tubing cutter, just enough to make an extra tight spot at the very end. That tight spot then stops any spin that the ball has and gives a clean release to the ball. Just a thought.
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Old 11-11-2005, 12:41 PM   #12
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i dont think spin on paintablls is good anyways. paintballs are not the same shape as bullets, so spine has a different effect.
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Old 11-11-2005, 01:49 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jester_s1
this isn't quite right. First, you are right that a too loose fit does cause bad accuracy by the air rushing past the ball. The ball goes to one side in that situation, and rolls out the barrel, inducing a spin that makes it hook. So that part is right.
The muzzle break is designed to improve accuracy by venting the pressure away from behind the ball just before it exits. The reason this helps is because just as the ball exits all the pressure behind it starts to blow out sideways. The same happens in firearms too, which is why a quality barrel crown is so important. A paintball will usually not fit a barrel well enough to make this even blowout happen, so the muzzle break is there to make it a non-issue. If the accuracy of this barrel improved by removing it, then I'd bet there was something wrong with the brake.
Spiral porting does not induce spin. It cannot induce spin and never will. All American barrels are accurate because they are slick on the inside and because of the dual bore. They are quiet because of the porting, which helps just a little with accuracy.
Here's a theory about why your mod helped: perhaps you crushed the end of the barrel just a little with the tubing cutter, just enough to make an extra tight spot at the very end. That tight spot then stops any spin that the ball has and gives a clean release to the ball. Just a thought.
I understand what you're saying and yes there is a very slight diameter change in the barrel so perhaps you may be right. I've currently shot 500 paintballs out of it and still shows same results, no chopping and superb accuracy for a stock barrel that owned my CP 2 piece. Might have to sell it PM me if interested.
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Old 11-11-2005, 07:18 PM   #14
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Thumbs up

Jester, good points, but these are all theories anyway, so I think we're at least thinking about it with logic in mind.

Aqua, spin on a perfectly round object is definitely not the same as spin on a bullet, so you are definitely correct on that one. But, spin on a paintball, while it may hook, slice, and/or rise up (as in the case of the flatline barrel by Tippmann - this barrel actually puts backspin on the ball, making it spin such that it makes the ball "rise", or stay flat longer, simulating "distance"), it will still make it more accurate than a perfectly round ball with no spin, as in the case of a baseball - the knuckle ball is thrown with no spin, which will literally duck, dive, and do all kinds of erratic things in the air pockets because of the naturally occuring "blemishes" (for lack of a better word) in the air currents. A paintball with a seam will also be affected more by this phenomenon, sort of like the threads on a baseball will affect its tragetory. But, you are correct about rifling being much better for a bullet than a round ball, hence why muskets in the old days, with their round lead balls for bullets, were far less accurate than the rifles of today.

Jester, one more thought: I have a 30-06 (pronounced "thirty-aught-six for those of you unfamiliar with guns) I hunted with (a long time ago). It was dead accurate. For my birthday, he purchased a muzzle break and a new butt-plate for it, and we took it to the range. Now, I couldn't tell if I lost speed, but I definitely didn't lose accuracy. A muzzle break does NOT improve accuracy in a rifle, but your theory on how it affects a paintball might be dead right. Good points - I like it.
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Old 11-11-2005, 07:47 PM   #15
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The downfall of the flatline is that yes it puts backspin on the ball (in a gravity free environment it would curve upwards) but the flatline must be shot at a perfect 90 Degree angle (so the barrel puts backspin on the ball) but Myself and most the other ballers with any common sense tilt the marker so the hopper is still behind the bunker. This will make the balls curve to the right or left because the flatline is putting side spin on the ball. Now this has nothing to do with the thread but here is the connection. Porting in theory is supposed to release all air behind the ball before it exits the barrel this is supposed to negate all spin. It doesn't always happen but this is what its supposed to do. This also is why broken balls cause bad accuracy. Becuase paint will block porting and cause extra drag on on side of the paintball that is shooting. I have shot the flatline on an egrip a5 and its very inaccurate when I shoot because I tilt the marker. Its not that great of a barrel and chops only hurts it more. And not to mention if barrels that spun the balls were more accurate you would see more of them. You would also see less things to try to prevent spin (like porting).
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Old 11-12-2005, 12:08 AM   #16
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I can borrow a tubing cutter, so I may try this one day. Might make a decent barrel to not put a silencer on for sniping, since those are not allowed.
To followup on BT's comments, everything I've read (which of course doesn't make it fact) says that the best possible accuracy for paintballs comes from no spin. Experience bears that out, as the most accurate barrels are the slickest ones.
BTW, muzzle brakes on most rifle barrels do not affect accuracy, because the rifles themselves aren't good enough quality to see a difference. But on match grade rifles military snipers and class 3 liscense holders have noticed a slight accuracy gain at extreme ranges by using a silencer. The reasons for that are the same as those that explain why the big porting in paintball barrels usually helps with accuracy.
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Old 11-19-2005, 10:30 AM   #17
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you probably just had a better paint-to-barrel match. did you try different kinds of paint?
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Old 11-19-2005, 10:52 AM   #18
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thats pretty sweet, so are you actually gonna use this barrel instead of your CP two piece?
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Old 11-19-2005, 11:00 AM   #19
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Yup
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Old 11-19-2005, 04:52 PM   #20
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.....if you want a barrel to be accurate just match the paint to the barrel. You dont need to start hacking your barrel into pieces.
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