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pbReview.com / SITE Inc. Stiffi Switch Barrel Kit / SITE Inc. Stiffi Switch Barrel Kit / SITE Inc. Stiffi Switch Barrel Kit

SITE Inc. Stiffi Switch Barrel Kit Reviews

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SITE Inc. Stiffi Switch Barrel Kit
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Number of Reviews: 32
Average Rating: 9.7 / 10
Manufacturer Website: Click here
Suggested Retail Price: $209

Manufacturer DescriptionSubscribe to Reviews on this Product - Edit this Product Listing
You Asked For It - We're Giving It To You! A St!ffi Barrel with interchangeable Breech Sizers.
*The all New St !ffi sW!tcH is a one piece .691 stepped bore
*Carbon Fiber Barrel with interchangeable 1 inch long Sizing Breech
*Uses the same micro-jeweled carbon fiber barrel as a standard St!ffi
*The Sizing Breeches use CCM’s Centr-Lokt technology to marry it
concentrically to the micro-jeweled St!ffi barrel.
*The sW!tcH is fitted with an attractive and functional muzzle
break and initial tests show the same remarkable low sound output
that St!ffi fans have raved about for over a year.
*You get the same St!ffi quality and accuracy….PLUS interchangeability
*The sW!tcH is a Tournament level barrel
*The rugged nylon carrying case has room for 3 barrels, 5 sizing breeches, and more.
Product Availability 
The SITE Inc. Stiffi Switch Barrel Kit is newer, so it should be commonly available, both new and used.
Places to Buy
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mrguru Sunday, June 6th, 2004
Period of
Product Use:
Less than a month26 of 26 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
More than 5 years
Similar
Products Used:
I have used a multitude of barrels. The Evil Pipe is the only thing I felt was even close.
Marker Setup: '03 VF Cocker, Worrblade, Nexus Kit, Palmer Fatty & Micro Rock, Stiffi switch kit, 88/5K Pure Energy Tank.

Tippmann A-5, E-Grip, Flatline or 12" J&J ceramic, Solid Stock, Palmer Stabilizer, Tasco RedDot.
Recommended
Paintballs:
Most any paint, since it is a kit. But you get what you pay for. This barrel will handle poor paint better than most, because it shoots clean [i]much[/i] easier.
Strengths: Quality
Adaptability
Weight
Features
Accuracy
Weaknesses: Price
Kit is not complete
Backs somewhat short
One barrel per thread style
Squeegee
Review: I recently bought into the hype and purchased a Sw!tch Kit. A friend of mine was raving about his Stiffi, and said the Sw!tch is even more amazing. Here is what I found out:

Quality: This Product is a real work of art. Looks great, is super lightweight yet durable, and is well made. It is not too flashy for rec/woodsball players, but will still look nice on most any speedball marker. It is astonishingly lightweight. It surprises anyone hand it to. I would expect it to snap like a twig, but having done some homework on the type of materials used for this, I am not worried at all about breaking it. I am less worried about his barrel deforming than I ever was with my Pipe. The manufacturing takes the porting into account as well.. Carbon fiber can leave runners and edges that will lead to premature wear on the structure. Like having a loose string on a sweater. Pull it and it all starts to unravel. Site did a very fine job of finish work on the barrels I have seen, and make sure that the holes are clean and have no edges. It greatly increases the amount of wear this barrel can handle. It will most likely outlast any standard barrel. No anodizing to wear thin and rust.

Adaptability: This is a very adaptable set-up. It has multiple backs for sizes of paint. Even most paint will vary day to day. Or during the day. Having multiple backs allows the user switch (thus the name) between bore sizes while still getting the performance of the stiffi. Also there are additional backs for more options and additional size fronts for longer or shorter barrels. 12", 14" & 16". On top of that, they all have a space in case made for them.

Weight: This is the lightest kit out there. Have a heavy marker? Why have a heavy barrel? Works better than most any barrel I have used, and it is super light to boot.

Features: These barrels have great porting, low friction, and a resistance to heat effects. The backs are designed to prevent them getting stuck on a marker. The case is able to accommodate all of your extra barrels (minus a 21" thunderpig) including a A5 flatline! This barrel is also extremely quiet. I am used to shooting a flatline and a Pipe. The first can be heard all over the field, and the second is still very loud (due to the angled porting). This is the quietest barrel I have heard that was not 18" with extra porting.

Accuracy: I have found that the accuracy is very good. My pipe system may have been better, but I have not used this barrel with a lot of different paint. It may be better with some. The barrel is a stepped bore, and have a very good thread system. So the ball gets good travel in the marker to build speed, and the barrel does not wiggle (even a little) while shooting. Either one can lead to lower accuracy, shot to shot.

Price: This is expensive. You hear that. All said and done, you might need to sell your younger sibling on the black market to afford it. Or at least put in some serious overtime. This system is at least $180, and that does not include all of the backs and the different size fronts. To get a second front is around $75+, and the backs are about $25+ each. So add $50+ if you want all of the sizes of backs.

Kit is not complete: What? Where is the rest? I was surprised to fing that there are not any more sizes available in the backs. I was expecting that they would have backs that are 2 more sizes up (.693 & .695). Sure you can order more parts, but at the price it goes for, I was expecting a bit more in options. Granted, they do have to core sizes, but I want to be able to have it accommodate anything.

Backs somewhat short: I will have to qualify this; there is a lot of debate on the length of barrel needed for a paintball to get up to speed, and the barrel [i]is[/i] stepped. The backs are short. Easy for storage, but if a paintball gets is full speed in the first 6 inches of travel, the bore sizer only helps in a very small portion of that. But if it gets it in the first 2 inches (the other school of though) this it is just fine. I am sure that it comes down to type of marker and operation style, as well as a number of other items. The porting does not start before the magic 6" of travel time, so regardless, you are getting most of the function. The back is more of a ball dent. So unless your ball matches the actual back of the barrel, you are losing a small amount of efficiency. This might be made up by the low friction of the barrel. Might be a problem, might not.

One barrel per thread style: Unlike a freak, it is not fairly easy to use the system on a Impulse, then a cocker, then an spyder, then a '98c. Most systems have this issue. The insert/back system of the freak allow buying just one new part to have it work on a new marker. On the sw!tch (like most systems) it is not possible without getting all new backs. So if you trade markers alot, or have a multitude of markers, this is a one thread style system. Most of us keep our markers (or all have the cocker threaded markers) so t is not an issue, but it could be an annoyance.

Squeegee: Can't use any old battle swab in a pinch. Don't want the barrel to develop runners due to the threads of the swab. Good thing the barrel shoots clean so quick, or this might be an issue. Make sure you are prepared with the right kind of squeegee when you go out to play, or clean up at home.
Conclusion: This is a very good barrel system, and I am very pleased with it. I see some potential issues, and am not happy that there are not more backs for the price. But for what you get, it is very high quality, well built, and works like a dream. If you have the money it is an awesome product.
Rating:
9 out of 10
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kwheezy2000 Monday, March 1st, 2004
The accuracy of this review is disputed. Please see discussion on the comments page.
Period of
Product Use:
Less than a month9 of 18 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
3 years
Similar
Products Used:
Freak, Quiet Riot, Pipe
Marker Setup: Red 2k2 vert feed autococker- ebladed, Rock reg, nexus ram, Stiffi switch set, Sidewinder, Unimount, Halo b
Recommended
Paintballs:
any
Strengths: looks, weight
Weaknesses: none
Review: First of all I would like to correct the user that wrote a review before me, you CAN use battleswabs in this set. You couldn't use the battle swabs on the old ones because of the crescent moon porting. This barrel has done away with the crescent moon porting, and the porting is no longer sharp, seems like someone doesn't know what they're talking about.

Second I would like to say that many autococker owners are worried about getting the barrel back stuck, stiffi saw this potential problem, and has holes in it's backs, so you can fit an allen wrench in to unscrew the back if it becomes stuck.

Third onto the performance. It is the single best kit I have used, once you get the barrel oiled, it is very very slick. It only weighs in the neighborhood of 2 oz so if your old stainless steel barrel was weighing you down, this is a good choice. It comes with 4 backs in .685, .687, .689, and .691 so it has all the major stuff. If you need more backs, go to www.sitemanufactoring.com and they have 2 more backs for like 20 dollars each in bigger sizes. Stiffi also had some of their old barrels come back with the tips broken off, well they fixed that too. They put aluminum around the tip of the barrel so you won't kill it sliding into bunkers. It cleaned itself in 2 shots, restoring the normal accuracy. It is surprisingly quite for the amount of porting it has- just 3 lines of about 15 small holes each.

Lastly on to price. This barrel kit is very cheap considering the exotic material that it incorporates. I simply talked to the company that was selling these barrels on Ebay, and asked them to come down on the price, and I ended up getting a really good deal (best not to disclose what I payed so they can make some profits). This barrel kit has some cool looks, and people kept asking me what kind of barrel it was.
Conclusion: Overall a great product that performs remarkably well.

This is the best barrel kit that I have ever used so take what you want from my review.
Rating:
10 out of 10
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lanthantos Tuesday, February 15th, 2005
Period of
Product Use:
Less than a month5 of 6 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
1 year
Similar
Products Used:
Lapco Snapshot- very quiet and accurate also, good barrel but doesent shoot thru breaks like the stiffis
Marker Setup: 04 LCD Dye Matrix (DM3), Crossfire 68/4500 hioutput tank, CP On/Off ASA, Hyper 2 reg, New style Dye Rocket LPR, St!ffi Switch Kit 14 inch Autococker thread
Tippman A5 / Lapco Snapshot barrel
Recommended
Paintballs:
LOL anything, you can match it
Strengths: 1) Accuracy
2)Self Cleaning
3) Ability to match paint size
4) QUIET !!!!!
Weaknesses: Only available in 2 colors, black carbon fiber, and mamba
Review: Got the stiffi switch kit for my Dye LCD Matrix about a couple weeks ago, came in a nice carry case w/room for 3 barrels, and netting holding the sizers in place.

Light as a feather, its unbelivable this thing is so strong

Went to the field to test it out, matched some paint to the bore (ended up being a .689 match) and went to chrono room, very consistent barrel and quiet.

Then i went to the field, this thing is DEAD ON accurate, from 50 yards i was putting ball on top of ball, at 75 yards, maybe a 2 inch spread, NO BREAKS ALL DAY with the perfect match even, and i shot 1000 rounds that day. Ppl were tripping on how quiet my marker was "dang, thats unreal".

2nd day of play i went to another field, and used .687 sizer w/a perfect paint match, no breaks again all day, this time a case of paint, same accuracy, same results (lots of kills).

I think the reason it works so well, the sizers are only 1 inch long, so the ball doesnt really have much room to travel before it reaches the tapered bore of the barrel (so if the ball is dimpled it may not break if you understand me).

I almost want one to break now, to see if its true how quick this thing self cleans.
Conclusion: GET IT NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Because its the best kit out there presently. I plan on buying a lapco barrel adapter so i can use this w/my A5 also, the snapshot will be gettting sold soon LOL
Rating:
10 out of 10Last edited on Tuesday, February 15th, 2005 at 1:33 am PST
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utg3825 Saturday, January 15th, 2005
Period of
Product Use:
Less than a month4 of 4 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
1 year
Similar
Products Used:
Freak: Not a very good kit. You get a lot of bore sizes for the price though.

Scepter: Probably the best barrel kit you can buy, but it's a little more expensive and it isn't as light.
Marker Setup: Series 5
J2 frame
X-stream 90/45
FBM Stilleto drop
Apache
Stiffi Switch
Recommended
Paintballs:
Nothing over .691, you can get up to 8(I think) different bores down to if you but CCM and SITE sizers. CCM aluminum/carbon fronts and sizers will work on this kit too.

This kit has .691, .689, .687, and .685 sizers stock, so most people wont need to buy any more of them.
Strengths: Bore variety.
Quiet.
Smooooooooooooooth interior.
LIGHT!
Looks cool IMO (espeically Mamba fronts)
Weaknesses: No swabs allowed.
Sizers are tiny.
Not amazingly efficient.
Not cheap.
Review: The main downside to this barrel is that the sizers are 1'' long. When you are using a cocker, this makes it so that you have to put a little allen wrench into one of the holes and un-jam the sizer every time you have to change them. It also might affect efficiency a little bit. You also can't use swabs with this barrel because they can cause the carbon fiber to unravel. I don't find this to be much of a weakness though because straight-shots and pull-throughs are much more effective squeegees anyway.

Other than that, this is one of the nicest kits I've used. Out of all the barrels I've seen, this one comes in second next to the Scepter. On my Series five, I was able to shoot a 9'' pattern at about 50-60 feet using ZAP Tork. Considering that it's cheap paint, that was some really good accuracy. With Marbs it will probably improve.

I don't mind heavy equipment too much, but the lighter my setup is, the better.

Some people claim that this barrel can shoot through breaks [there are always people who say "(insert barrel name here) is the best" but they are rarely correct]. I don't believe that a truly self-cleaning barrel will be produced any time in the near future, if ever, but this barrel does recover fairly well from breaks. You should still use a straight shot, but you aren't completely screwed if a ball breaks in one of these. I have an SP All-American and Progressive, both of which shoot fairly well, but they will NOT recover from a break.

Overall this is a great kit.
Conclusion: It's pretty expensive, but you get what you pay for. Comes in a nice case too.
Rating:
9 out of 10
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ConnorKovl Tuesday, March 7th, 2006
The accuracy of this review is disputed. Please see discussion on the comments page.
Period of
Product Use:
3 months4 of 5 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
2 years
Similar
Products Used:
pipe, freak,
Marker Setup: Red 05 vision Shocker
HE bolt
Cp Reg
Empire Reloader B
PMI 45 45 tank
Empire cover
Recommended
Paintballs:
evil, medevil, walmart...?
Strengths: Light, looks, accuracy, sound
Weaknesses: Not many, price..?
Review: i picked this barrel up at the shop, i thought it was going to break, I thought i could snap it. So the owner made a deal with me, If i snap it, he buys me any gun i want, and if i don't, I Buy him a shiny new DM3. What do you know, my gorilla strength didn't break it, and i bought him a DM3, terrible loss. The weight and durability of this was amazing, I loved the accuracy too.
Conclusion: good, but lots of money. A nine, just because of the price.
Rating:
9 out of 10
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ghost271 Sunday, August 29th, 2004
Period of
Product Use:
Less than a month3 of 3 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
More than 5 years
Similar
Products Used:
Freak Barrel Kit
Dye Barrels
Marker Setup: '04 Immortal Viking
48/3000 Pure Energy
Full Freak Kit, Switch Kit
Apache Ricochette Loader
Recommended
Paintballs:
Any
Strengths: Light !!!
Dead Accurate
Hot Lookin'
Weaknesses: None that I've encountered
Review: Well I got my kit this week and played with it the first time today.
I will start by saying that this barrel is easily the lightest on the market . I have noticed with my Viking that I feel a little more of the kick now that I don't have the heavy Freak on the front of my gun. The design and finish of the barrel is top notch and they have little holes on the sizer inserts to slip your allen key into if the insert is tightened to much into the gun.
Secondly, is the noise reduction. My Vike was quiet before this barrel, but now its even moreso. I actually had one guy today tell me how cool my gun sounded. First time I've ever heard that compliment.
And lastly I would like to say how well this barrel shot heavily dimpled Blaze paint. I thought for sure I was going to have a crappy day after I opened my box of paint and saw all the dimpled balls. I walk to the chrono station and started firing. Ball on Ball !! OK sure. Not every single one but like 3-4 at a time then two more would stack on top of each other a little more to the left or right. I can only begin to imagine how this barrel will shoot with nice round paint. I was getting so many long ball shots today i can't recall the last time I had so many. I am used to using a Red Dot sight and so I'm still getting used to sighting down the barrel. After spending close to $300 CAD on the Freak Kit I was a little hesitant on dropping more money on the Switch. Let me tell you I wish I had this barrel years ago. Just the looks and compliments people give me on how nice my gun is and how cool the barrel is, strokes the ego just a little bit more.

I think I may have had one barrel break today but I'm not sure. The reason is all of a sudden I had two balls do the 'loopty loops and hook ' . Well after the 3rd shot the balls were shooting on top of each other again like nothing had happened at all. When I took my barrel off later on, it was smooth and shiny as glass.
Conclusion: In conclusion I will say this. My Freak Kit will no longer be accompaning me to the field anymore. It will be my 'lender' barrel for friends.
The Switch is top notch and the quality and workmanship shows.
If you want the best it's gonna cost ya a little more. Save your pennies and buy this Kit.

On a side note. These kits are seldom ever for sale used on the PBNation B/S forums. I see tons of Freak Kits, Empire Kits, ULs, Pipe Kits and others for sale. But rarely Switch Kits. When one is posted it is gone VERY quickly. That alone has got to tell you something ;-P
Rating:
10 out of 10
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empirekid17 Tuesday, January 4th, 2005
Period of
Product Use:
3 months3 of 4 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
3 years
Similar
Products Used:
Freak
Freak back and a stiffi front
regular stiffi
Dye Ultra lights
Marker Setup: Prostock autococker
empire reloader b
worr blade bolt
stiffi switch barrel
68ci 3,000 psi tank
Recommended
Paintballs:
GAP
Draxxus
Cyclone
Any good paint
Strengths: Accurate
Quiet
Interchangable bores
Light
Looks great
Best barrel I have ever used
Weaknesses: Have to use a pull squeege.
Review: You have to use a pull squeege becuase the battle swab will leave its hairs in the carbon fiber. The barrel is the best barrel and I would recomend it over the Freak.The barrel is light, quiet, really accurate and durable. The interchangable bores make it easy for you so you can use any paint you want without having to worry about breaks in the barrel. And it is better than the freak becuase if you want 4 bore sizes for the freak they are like 20 dollars a piece wich is 80 dollars never mind the price of the barrel, why do that when you can get a light accurate quiet barrel that comes with 4 bore sizes that are easier to install than the freakfor a lower price, and it is a better barrel.
Conclusion: Great barrel and would recomend it over any barel even the freak.
Rating:
10 out of 10Last edited on Tuesday, January 4th, 2005 at 6:44 pm PST
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The Haze Friday, June 4th, 2004
Period of
Product Use:
3 months3 of 4 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
More than 5 years
Similar
Products Used:
Freek, All-American
Marker Setup: 03` E-Bladed Outkast with complete freeflow internals.
Recommended
Paintballs:
Anything, I've shot the lowest grade to the highest grade of paint through it.
Strengths: Light weight, Durable, Accurate, Cleans broken paint out in 6-8 shots.
Weaknesses: Price (well worth it though), other than that, NONE
Review: A member on our team first introduced us to the Stiffi-Tip that he was running on his Imp. We all shot it and were quite impressed with the weight and how accurate it was compaired to the Freek front that was on it. After I seen what this Tip could do, I really wanted to see what a Switch-It kit would do. I was fed up with SP and there whole load of BS they were pulling, so I bought a Switch-It kit.

From the first time I laid my eye's and hands on it I was honestly impressed. The kit comes in a nice (small) nylon bag that completely unzips. This is nice because I was use to lugging the case that my Freek belonged in, so there is the first possitive. The next thing that you notice is the looks of the barrel. Ofcourse it's all carbon fiber with an Al tip, but it honestly looks good. The next thing that you notcie is how light this barrel actually is. In words you can try and describe it (the barrel weights about the same as a Freek incert) but words don't give it it's true props, you just have to see for yourself. So, once I was past the looks, weight and the actual presents of the product, I need to shoot some paint through this beast. The first time I shot paint through the barrel was with PMI Premi's. The first hopper I shot through it I was impressed in the first 20 shots. The accuracy of this barrel was hands down the best and how quite it was even amazed me more.

Since the frist time I tested the barrel I have used it extensivly. I have shot the low grade paint and the high grade paint through the barrel and its all the same. The one thing that I did get to witness is, A player on my team was using the Switch-It and he shot a stream of paint before the break. Well, he forgot to turn on his HALO and he broke a ball in the barrel. The break was cleaned out in 6 shots and the balls were flying as stright was they were before the break. It's honestly amazing.
Conclusion: This barrel blows any other barrel out of the water. I have shot most of the barrels out there and there isn't one that holds a candle to this one. If you want to add and edge to your game on the field, get this barrel. I also strongly recommend this barrel to any serious tourney players like ourselfs. This barrel will amaze you and I promise that. Try this barrel out and let it speak for it's self.
Rating:
10 out of 10Last edited on Friday, June 4th, 2004 at 11:25 pm PST
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Dixie Flatline Wednesday, June 23rd, 2004
The accuracy of this review is disputed. Please see discussion on the comments page.
Period of
Product Use:
6 months3 of 5 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
2 years
Similar
Products Used:
Many barrels....Armson SSR - 32 degrees Carbon fibre - Freak kit
Marker Setup: MacDev Cyborg
Tippmann A-5
Recommended
Paintballs:
Draxxus paint works amazing
Strengths: VERY accurate, quiet, doesn't chop balls, shoots through paint very well
Weaknesses: Can't use swab, Carbon fibre is fragile, autococker threads only
Review: Man, I got this barrel in February, and it didn't work, ( i would get many, many chops) so I sent it back and I got a replacement, hoping that I just got a lemon the first time.

Turns out the breech sizers were the problem, too much anodizing on them... Now that I have it back and it works, I haven't chopped a single ball in three cases.

This barrel looks very nice, It is very light, super accurate and quiet... I'm sorry I ever doubted this barrel when I gave it a review of 4/10, I'm here now to fix my review!!

I use high quality tourney paint (Draxxus Blaze or Inferno) which have a very small bore - you can also use Draxxus midnights without any problems whatsoever.

Not being able to use a swab isn't a big deal, because I really don't think you will need it...I haven't chopped a ball in three cases since I had the bore sizers replaced. Get yourself a nice rubber pull through squeegee and give this barrel the care it deserves.

Since I haven't been able to chop a ball in it, I purposely broke a couple balls with my fingers and slid them through the barrel to make a mess and see how well the switch could handle it... about 3 shots and it was shooting darts again!! By the end of the match when I screwed my barrel off, I could barely even tell that I had paint in the barrel!

I can't recommend this barrel enough to people who ask, GET IT!!! Forget the freak, spend a little extra and get this, you won't be sorry!!

Unfortunately, it only comes in cocker threads for now, but it seems many new markers are using the cocker threads as a standard now, so it shouldn't be too much of a problem... And it keeps all the Smart parts owners from getting it too!! HAHAHAA!!
Conclusion: I have to give it a 9 only because I had to get things fixed with the barrel.. Having said that, their customer service is top notch... I spoke to the president of SITE himself when I had to get my problem solved, and I respect that - they stand by their product. If it had come to me working the way it does now, I would have definitely given this barrel a 10
Rating:
9 out of 10Last edited on Monday, July 5th, 2004 at 10:41 am PST
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hacker947 Sunday, July 17th, 2005
Period of
Product Use:
6 months2 of 2 people found this review helpful.

Paintball
Experience:
4 years
Similar
Products Used:
Freak,

Not kits: ultralite and regular stiffi
Marker Setup: Red Proto Matrix, Musashi 3, CP Roller Trigger, Stiffi Switch, Redz feedneck, Hybrid on/off
Recommended
Paintballs:
anything that isnt dimmpled real bad
Strengths: Light
Accurate
looks nice
carry pouch
Quiet
Weaknesses: In my mag the backs would get stuck
expensive
Review: well my teamate bought a regular stiffi and i tried that out and was very impressed with it. I went to buy one and saw the switch kit for only 80 more ( i think) so i read a bunch of reviews and decided to try it. I got it a few days later and open it up. I like how it came with a carry case that fit everything in it nice and easy. then i put it on my mag and i didnt tighten the back to the barrel tight enough, so when i took the barrel off the back was tightly attached to my mag body. Now site thought ahead and put holes in the backs so you can stick an allen wrench in the hole to get it off, but the problem with my mag bdy was that the body covered the holes. so after a lot of dry firing it did come out. ( i have had the same thing happen ono my proto but the allen wrench fixed it) I took this barrrel to the field and the first thing was a few people were asking my what it was and howw much and did i like it. it is def. a crowd drawler. with this barrel on my proto it is incredibly quiet . Then on the field (drilling) I was walking my trigger and shooting at a two by four and was consistently hitting it from about 60 feet away. After that moment i was completly sold. Plus with how light it is the marker feels very light. I must say a greeat kit.
Conclusion: Overall i am very happy with my purchase and have yet to use anything like it. In my oppion it was worth every penny. If you buy it you will not look back
Rating:
10 out of 10Last edited on Sunday, July 17th, 2005 at 6:35 am PST
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