IPI system 3.0 (intelligent push-button indicator)
Firing modes include semi-auto, 3-round burst, and full auto
New LED light display format
9 1/2" aluminum barrel
Sleek, custom design receiver
Reactive trigger response with up to 14 shots per second capability
Vizion rear cocking system
Two trigger finger with regulation trigger guard
Adjustable trigger pull
Expansion chamber with foregrip
Tournament velocity adjuster
Vertical ball feed
Low pressure chamber
Bottomline set-up with stainless steel hose
Quick disconnect pin
External recharge port
Operates on C02 or compressed air
The Kingman Spyder Imagine '04 is older, so while it may be available used and in a few cases new, it is not commonly available anymore.
The accuracy of this review is disputed. Please see discussion on the comments page.
Period of Product Use:
Less than a month
95 of 109 people found this review helpful.
More than 5 years
Similar Products Used:
98' ANS Autococker (hard to let this go for electro)
04 Imagine Blue Grey
-Dye Sticky Grips
-8'' Drop forward
-88cu 3000psi Nitro duck CA tank
-Inline reg (off autococker)
-Shocktech Derlin Bolt
Barrel, Bolt, Grips
PRICE! Very light. Trigger. Fast. adjustable trigger. did i mention PRICE.
Barrel is junk. Bolt needs to go as well as grips.
This is my first venture into the electro age and I have to say that I am pretty impressed. I've always known that Spyders are reliable guns so I decided to go with this one first. The milling on this gun looks really nice. You would never guess it was a Spyder. I'll break down this gun briefly.
Since this gun only costed me about 140 dollars i was stoked to see that i had some money to put into upgrades. So the cost is the biggest strength. The milling is very nice and makes the body SUPER light. I was amazed after carrying around my cocker. This marker can shoot pretty fast. I was able to keep up w/ higher end markers. Something I could not do w/ my mechanical autococker. The trigger can be adjusted by taking off the grip frame and turning a screw. The marker is also easily disassembled for cleaning.
The first thing that had to go was the barrel. I don't think I even put it on the gun once! The second thing is the bolt. Definately upgrade to a derlin bolt because the stock one will tear up the gun! The stock grips are also crap. They are so uncomfortable. I went with dye stickys.
Overall this gun can be suped up and cost you almost nothing. Definately a money saver. Good for speedball players like myself. You may want to slap an inline reg on there if you have the extra cash.
Definately recommended! Although I am not new to the sport, i wanted to try out an electro before spending a lot of money. Now i realize I don't have to with this gun! Good first choice for a new player or a seasoned player from the old school (mechanical markers and pump guns!)
spyder victor,stingray,talon,model 98, ras intruder,blade,spyder compact 2k, im not even going to compare these to the imagine because they are in a different class, so theres realy no point to do so.
spyder imagine,12 0z tank, 12 volt revy, everything else is stock right now
better barrel,electro hopper,new bolt if you want to, im probably going to buy a regulator and some sort of drop forward for it,better trigger,new springs,new grips.
It's fast, lightweight, cheap (for an electro) and looks great
outshoots gravity fed hoppers (I'm cheap) stock barrel Isn't the best (read below)
the spyder imagine is the first electronic gun that I have bought. the main reason that Ibought it was because of the price.
speed- this thing is fast, I've only ever used pumps and semis, so the first time that I gassed it up and shot it on full auto i was very surprised.
x-chamber- no need to buy one as its included.
sight rail. this is a problem that I had with my victor. it didnt do anything and it looks better without it. the new imagine has a built in sight rail and I think that it looks amazing. the milling that is done on the gun looks great in green which is the color I bought it in.
the only real problem that I have had with this gun is the speed. I only had a gravity fed hopper when I bought this, so i was chopping a lot of balls on full auto. im buying either a 12 volt revy or a reloader this week So that will take care of the problem.
The stock barrel isn't amazing, but I really like it, the only reason that I listed it as a weakness is because most people end up buying a new barrel anyway. I will probably end up buying a new one.<<the 14 inch smart parts progressive barrel works great on this gun in my opinion>>
the grips. these are the only thing on the imagine that i really do not like.for the price of the gun kingman usa could have made it a lot easier for buyers by supplying better grips. the stock grips stick out from the grip frame. they also feel kinda cheap.now while this is by no means a reason not to buy the gun i would buy a new grip for it, or make them out of something. you can finds lots of internet sites with all kinds of customizations for your spyder.
all in all this is an amazing gun I have had no problems with it, its amazingly easy to clean, and it is a very good starter electric gun. the 3 firing modes on it work great. the three round burst doesn't seem like it is all that useful, because you have to hold the trigger down to actually shoot all 3 balls, full auto is a lot easier to use and you can make it any round burst that you want.semi auto is very fast and full auto is even faster.
<<edit>> i finally went out and bought a 12 volt revy. so far i have had no problems chopping balls.it keeps up to it very well.
i also went out and bought a pyschoballistics drop forward with an on off valve.it makes the marker extremely well balanced, and it also helps to steady the shot.
I would recommend to anyone that is even considering buying a new gun to buy this,its affordable, and you get lots of value for your money.just make sure that when you buy it you get a fast hopper for it. i bought the 12 volt revy for mine, but now that i've used it a bit, i think that i should have bought the empire reloader.
10 out of 10
Last edited on Thursday, August 26th, 2004 at 4:35 pm PST
12v Revvie, new barrel of your choice, and a regulator with macroline hose.
Customizability; tournament level capabilites once adjusted
Difficult to adjust it for low pressure set up; lacks drop forward.
After using a mechanical marker for over three years, I finally decided to step into the electronic age. I went with the Imagine because it offered a customizable middle road between looks and performance. After several months of use, I'm pleased to say that the Imagine 2k4 has either met or exceeded my expectations on the issues of reliability and efficiency. I'm still hardcore over my old mechanical Xtra, but honestly, the upgraded Imagine is just a party to bring out on the field. It is a versatile electronic marker with no outstanding weaknesses and a good balance of performance and speed out of the box.. Anyhow, that's as biased as I hope to get about it. Here's the real review of it as of now:
1). Reliability: The Imagine 2k4 is extremely reliable. The batteries of my Revvie fell out without me realizing it, so I continued to fire at a rate of 8-13bps throughout the game. Not one single chop even without the revvie working. It wasn't a continuous stream, more like short but really fast bursts so I think gravity was just barely keeping up with me. I'm sure that if I had sat there and fired a fast constant stream I'd have had a ball break in any marker.
2). Speed and Accuracy: This is no joke. The Imagine can keep up with the high end electro markers without a problem. It's fast and very accurate with a good barrel and bolt.
3). Customizablity: You can put almost anything on this marker. In fact, I recommend it. Remove everything stock and pick a regulator from a reputable company (AKA, CP, Bob Long, etc), get new dye sticky grips, put a macroline, buy a delrin bolt from whoever and trick this gun out.
4). Looks: great milling makes it light and sleek.
5). Electronic Trigger: not quite as "mouse-clickingly" soft as an Angel. After some adjustment walking the trigger becomes decently comparable.
6). Easy maintenance: like most Kingman markers, break-down and cleaning is easy. Just keep the bolt and o-rings oiled as well as the striker, and make sure your IPI board is clean and dry.
7). Internal cocking makes it great for tight snapshooting: you don't have to worry about the bolt hitting your mask.
8). Firing modes are easily accesible and the LED is very easy to see even in bright sunlight. (note: if you purchased this marker from a discount retailer and can't access the firing modes, then they have removed the "JE30B" tournament lock switch. You will need to replace it, or connect the leads yourself with some wiring.)
1). Lacks a drop forward: this makes any tank off-balance and unwieldy.
2). Stock barrel is a 9.5 inch piece of rolled up aluminum.
3). The trigger has some slack. Adjust it.
4). Stock bolt scratches a bit (totally normal). Fix with new bolt: I recommend either Superfly or the Kingman ACS. If you are going to stick with the stock bolt, I suggest you remove the venturi with some needle-nose pliers.
5). Stock grips are flimsy. Get new ones.
6). Dirt can get into the open bolt chamber.
7). If you're going to get a macroline, remember that spyders are METRIC, so use the appropriate fittings or you'll drive yourself nuts.
8). Difficult to get to operate at a low pressure with a regulator. (see bottom article for more info).
That's pretty much it in a nutshell. The rest of this review is mainly for those who are planning to add a regulator and set up for LP. I had problems with it at first, so I hope reading this helps.
I stripped the Xtra of all it's best parts, transferred it right to the Imagine and boom: I had an upgraded Imagine on the spot. I had already ordered a grip regulator (long) from Custom Products as well as a J&J, so all was well until they arrived in the mail. Then the troubles that would have prompted a new player to write a "this gun sucks" review began.
I got the CP regulator in chrome, so against the green anodizing of the receiver body it was sexy. I disassembled everything, and screwed in the regulator into the adapter. Two problems: 1). I had ordered a regulator with a gauge port so there was a big hole in it. 2). The regulator would not accept the stock steel braided hose.
So off I go to my local pro shop with money to buy a gauge, some teflon tape, as well as a macroline fitting plus the macroline itself. I stood at the counter top and installed everything on the spot. Then I aired it up. No leaks, so that was good, but then I fired it and boom... recocking problems. So I turned up the pressure to about 270 psi and that fixed it. So then I go to the chrono station to adjust it. To my dismay, I was only shooting 150fps. I turned up the reg to as close to 500psi (max efficient regulating pressure for the type I had) and turned the velocity adjuster all the way in. With pressure at 480psi and velocity adjuster all the way in, I was capped at 250 fps.
I was disappointed, but still that was better than not having a regulator at all and blasting the standard tank regulated 850psi through my marker every shot. So I went home and took it apart, and by some coincidence I decided to take apart my old Xtra as well. I figured I may have to get a high flow valve from AKA, but I wanted to see what I could modify at home. I looked at the vertical adapter on the Imagine and saw that it only had one hole for gas inlet. Then I looked at the vertical adapter on the Xtra and saw that it had two holes for gas inlet. (I know, I was surprised, too.) So I switched out the Imagine's adapter for the Xtra, and I also added the drop forward from the Xtra since the Imagine didn't come with one. Next, I added a stiffer spring with some extra washers for tension. When I went back to the shop to chrono, my shots went screaming at 320+fps. Now with everything adjusted properly, I average 280 (+/-5fps) with the regulator at 350psi without a high flow valve.
Basically, do everything you can aside from changing the high flow valve to get it to operate under 500 psi. Remember to read the manual on your regulator. If you overpressurize it beyond it's max pressure inlet, the structure will fail and you'll have to throw it away. (aka, be careful if you have a 4500psi tank). Here's a good site with instructions on how to configure a spyder for LP set up. Do it at your own risk, or get professional help.
Post Comment 11.14.2004
I ran into another player using the older version of this marker at the field last weekend. He was having a major problem with the solenoid not tripping the trigger sear. He let me have a look at it and the odd thing was it would only fire after every fourth shot without fail. "Click click click bang click click click bang." I thought initially that something was wrong with the sear. I should have told him then, but after I got home I figured out what could be causing the problem. The pattern was too regular to be a mechanical malfunction; it would always shoot on the fourth shot. The board is designed to draw power off of a 9.6 volt metal hydride rechargeable battery. As far as I know, retail stores only sell standard 9 volt batteries. I think the guy, who had been using this marker for more than a year, drained his 9.6 volt battery and decided to put a standard 9 volt in there. That meant that he was short four tenths of a volt which would explain why the capacitor wasn't receiving enough current to trip the solenoid. In other words, don't use standard 9 volt batteries to run your IPI board. It even says it in the manual. It's a noobish concept, I know, but I hope it helps prevent others from doing what this guy did.
Post Comment: 1/25/07
Heh, been a while. It's a little late in coming, but I stand corrected by some friendly comments. Using a regular 9 volt battery doesn't hurt anything at all. I know now from experience. Rock on, ballers.
The Imagine 2k4 is a high quality marker. It's an 7.5-8.5 when stacked against Angels, but in its own category as a low end electronic marker it is one of the best you can buy. A stock Imagine is more than enough for recreational play. But if you're looking to play tournaments and speedball, you'll need to add some upgrades to be truly competitive. Get the upgrades. After that, it's all you.
10 out of 10
Last edited on Thursday, January 25th, 2007 at 9:02 pm PST
Angel speed 04
.Spyder Imagine (old imagine)
Tippman 98 custom
Brass Eagle Eradicator
None of these guns are as good exept for E-99 and maybe tippman98
Spyder Imagine 04, with a Smart Parts Progressive Barrel, Pure Energy Fixed n2 3000 psi, sweet spot trigger, Hybrid Technologies R-Drive Stage 2 Inline Regulator, t-board, ramping chip, breakbeam eyes
New Barrel, a new Bolt , drop foward , and a NITRO TANK, new trigger, the t-board, a new ramping chip, break beam eyes, T-switch 50g
Accurate w/ a new barrel
Not accurate w/ stock barrel
Not bad at all
I got this GUN then right away i went into the pb field my friends made in my cousins back yard and tested it. The first time i shot it, it was VERY VERY accurate. I could hear the sounds arround me other than the BANG the gun made. I switchedt from semi, to three burst, then to auto and it NEVER CHOPPED a ball ( you need a good hopper). which is awsome
Its a great buy, great price. buy it. But get the t-board.
10 out of 10
Last edited on Thursday, May 10th, 2007 at 7:20 pm PST
original imagine -not NEARLY as good
e-99, electra, fenix, pilot, etc., etc.
Spyder Imagine 2k4, Evo 2, rest stock
new barrel, evo 2 or halo B this gun outshoots revys, reloads, TSA's, richochets, almost anything cept the evo 2 and halo B, also get a new bolt made of delrin
Very light, fastest spyder made (trigger is lighter than any others), good looking, built well
stock barrel stinks, you need an electro hopper or it chops ALOT, bolt scratches alot
Ive used this gun about 3 times so far, it performs great. I used to have a Revvy 12 volt but i popped ALOT with it so i had to upgrade to the evo 2, insanly fast, if your fingers are fast enough you can keep up with angels, no joke ive done it, even when you pop it still shoots pretty well, looks very good and is easy to use. Bolt is already scratched but that happens to all so just buy a new one made of delrin (shocktech makes nice ones)
-performs very very well for speedball or woodsball and you can barely feel it on the field ( SOOOO LIGHT!!) kinda brigth LEDs so if you play in the dark then thats a bad.
BUY THIS GUN!!! it is the best gun for the money and outperforms every other spyder (ive shot every one of them) including the $319 fenix, upgrade and you can play with the best (shockers. angels. autocockers ,etc etc)super fast, looks good, and its made by kingman and they have great techs always on hand!! get it i gave it a 10 AMAZING!!
- Barrel ( ALL GUNS HAVE THESE PROBLEMS )
- Grip ( ALL GUNS HAVE THESE PROBLEMS )
PROS ( Postive things about the gun )
When i first saw my friends gun the spyder imagine ( old version ) I was amazed at the performance it was an awsome gun for the price and it performs very well the moment i saw my friends gun like this i bought it the next week!
when i first bought it, it didnt chop a single paintball and i was at the BIG GAME 2004 Event at www.paintballaction.net. I went through about 4000 paintballs and didnt chop a single ball! i was amazed because i was on full auto for alot of the time and on semi auto this gun kicks ass!! i can get up to about 4-6 balls per second with a stock cheap hopper ( Cheap hopper $5.00 ones ).
CONS ( Negative things about the gun )
This gun had very few cons so it was hard to write this part of the review! anyways the cons on this gun is the barrel needs to be upgraded! ( All guns have these small problems not to worry!) Also the Grip is hard Dye Sticky Grip would solve it! or Evil Grip
They both go for about $35 Cdn. $29.95 U.S.
This is not a con but if you play in tournaments or you are trigger happy and like to shoot lots of paintballs VERY FAST then i would recommend any motorized loader like the 9v Revy, Halo B, Halo TSA LED AND LCD, 12v revy, Empire, Etc.
Another nice thing to have NOT A NEED THOUGH!! ( NOT A NEED )
My gun has Nitro tank which is nice! because the spyder imagine 2k4 is very efficient on nitro you can get about 1000-1100 shots with a 3000 psi 48 CI tank thats the tank i have!
My Marker Setup:
Spyder Imagine 2k4 (2004)
14" Knockdown barrel
3A 3000 Psi 48 CI Nitro, HPA Tank
***Motorized loader soon to come***
Overall this gun is a 10/10 = 100% good quality
P.s. Awsome gun for intermedite players or even some beginners even some pro players if they tricked this gun out to the max.
Overall this gun is the BOMB!!! Best marker on the market for it's price and it's performance. Awsome gun for intermedite players or even some beginners
Affordable, 14bps, pretty accurate with stock barrel
LOUD!, dirt can get in the bolt shaft, flimsy grip covers.
For the price it's a great marker. Personally I wouldn't bother with the Fenix or Pilot cuz Spyders perform pretty much the same and you're paying for different milling, maybe a reg, drop forward. In the case of firing modes, burst and auto is just some extra to put on their ads. You can shoot faster than the auto setting and most fields won't even allow you to use them.
The Imagine fires well and consistent enough once you've adjusted the trigger. The only real problems with breaks only happened when my field was using a cheaper paint for a few weeks. Other than that I'm not sitting there cleaning my barrel everytime I go out on the field. But it has had a few breaks.
I started having some drop offs after awhile and the marker was topping off at around the 250-70fps range with the velocity adjuster cranked. But that was fixed simply by stretching out the spring (or you could buy a heavier spring).
My main beef was with the loudness of this marker with the stock barrel. It had a very distinct "KLAK" and I was dubbing it as the cannon for awhile. Solve it with a Teardrop or Progressive. Unless you're going to settle with this marker for awhile (or just mod the heck out of it), I wouldn't bother with the more expensive barrels like the DYE or Freak.
Also, take into consideration of replacing that plastic elbow with something else. For one thing a metal feedneck is more durable and the smoke plastic elbow makes the hopper sit way too high (can you say hopper hit?).
One might also want to thing about getting new grips because the stock ones make the frame feel chunky and they're quite flimsy.
I highly recommend the Imagine for someone who wants to get into paintball or wants an electro but doesn't want to fork out on something way more costly. I know that there're tourney players out there that use Spyders and have held their ground with them. Heck I've used this marker and have taken out experienced guys who are sporting Shockers, Intimidators and whatnots. So it's all about you and knowing how to use what you've got. Sure it doesn't rain paint like the $1000+ markers but'll keep you in the game as long as you know how to play smart paintball. I give it an eight cuz this gun doeas what it's suppose to do and does it well. Not perfect but that's why people'll put down the big bucks on something like a DM4.
The barrel sucks of course.
Thats about it for the price.
First off let me say that this has to be the best looking stock body for a spyder. It comes in either green or blue(mine was a darker blue than in the picture shown on pbreview but i like it better anyway).Performance wise, it performs just like all the other Spyders not bad but nothing spectactular. This is a perfect gun for someone who wants their first electro, its very fast and the trigger is very light, you can also shorten the trigger i shortend mine so it is resting on the switch. The main thing that drew me to this gun was the price, its only about 130 at most sites thats cheaper than about all the other electro Spyders, even the old Imagines. My friend has an Imagine select and i have noticed two differences between are electro grip frames. The first difference is that my lights are way brighter, these l.e.d. lights are incredably bright, on his you cant see them very well outside, on mine they practically light up the day, this could be thought of as a bad thing if your trying to sneak around in the woods but its not that big of a deal for me. The second difference is the starting firing rate, the Imagine has 2 firing rates for the 3 round burst and the full auto firing modes, one is really slow and one is faster. On the imagine select, it starts in slow mode, on mine it starts in fast mode its not that big of a deal, neither of the two differences are, i just found them interesting.
This is a very good gun for the probably one of the best in its price range. If your looking into buying a Spyder or other cheap marker i definatly recomend this to you.
I give this product a 10.
10 out of 10
Last edited on Sunday, October 3rd, 2004 at 2:16 pm PST
2k3 cocker w/ dye sticky and a 2 piece freak with a .68 aluminum barrel insert. 12 v rev and a 3000 47ci crossfire tank
New Bolt, New Barrel, Drop Forward, Tighten Trigger Pull, Dye Sticky Grip.
Better Trigger, Nicer Milling
LOUD, CHOPS, a bit slow
I got this gun a bit ago and it looked nice, an average spyder but with better milling. I took it out of the case, and it had a few tools, battery charger, and other stuff. The current stock rechargable battery was not charged so i decided to take it out and put in a 9v. The LED was pretty bright which is good for game play.
I quickly screwed in a 20 oz C02 tank i had laying around and put my hopper on it and put in some nelson hotspot paintballs. The grip was sort of annoying. It felt hard and wasn't the best grip in the world, I would get a Dye Sticky grip. But you don't really have to replace the grip, but it would be realllly helpful.
So i went outside and started shooting. It was a bit slow (but then again i usually use higher end markers.) So i quickly fixed this by adjusting the trigger pull and moving it right next to the micro switch which worked some wonders when it came down to it, and it went considerably faster.
The thing i hated the most about this gun was that it was most likely the loudest damn electronic gun I have ever heard in my life and chopped so much paint!!!! I just couldn't believe that a bolt would be that loud and chop that much paint. So how do you fix that? Well, I bought an acs bolt that had come not to long ago. The difference was magical! A lot softer because instead of a crap bolt, there was a spring powered bolt which made life a whole lot easier. No more chops and no a lot quieter.
Next thing I would get is a new barrel, the stock barrel is what i would refer to as Junk. (Stuff Not that doesn't do the job right.) I don't know what broke more balls at first, the barrel or the bolt. So i fixed this up and got a reliable smart parts progressive barrel. AGAIN LIFE WAS EASY GOING!
This Next thing that would possibly help is getting a drop forward, or even a mini drop. The gun sort of looks ugly when it comes down to the bottom line system so you can make your gun more proffessional and prettier with a drop. again (Just a suggestion.)
All in all if your planning to use this gun regularly I would get all the things listed. A slow, loud, and choppy gun is not really a good gun.
5 out of 10
Last edited on Sunday, January 15th, 2006 at 12:21 am PST
2" Flame Drop Forward
16" Freak Barrel
68 3000 psi with empire tank cover
15* assult block with smart parts guage
Check it sure fit neck
Accuracy is not good if you don't have a good barrel.
I have used the imagine for about a year, and I have concluded that it is a great gun for any level of player. The gun is quite fast, if you move the trigger closer to the censor point. The stock barrel on the gun is the worst. I recommend a 16" Freak as it will consistently make your shot more accurate.
Overall, this gun is very good for all levels of playing, as long as you upgrade a little at a time. I think you should get it!
10 out of 10
Last edited on Saturday, June 4th, 2005 at 2:15 pm PST