Brass Eagle guns sold at Wal-Mart. The $30 Talon Ghost and the $50 Triton.
Spyder TL Plus with no upgrades. I bought a 20oz Co2 tank to go with it.
To early to tell.
Before I "review" this gun let me supply some background info about me;
I'm new to paintball. I tried it some time back (years ago) at a local, indoor paintball center and enjoyed it but never really pursued it beyond that....until about two weeks ago.
Not really sure where to start I went to Wal-Mart to check out the selection (I had checked out the selection at the paintball center but wasnt sure I could justify spending $150+ just yet).
I was real tempted to buy the $105 package that they had at Wal-Mart which included the Triton, mask, gloves, etc......(no tank though)
But, again, $105 still seemed a little much to invest. So I went with the $30 Talon Ghost instead. I bought a cheapo mask and some Diablo Dusk paintballs.
For $60 I was ready to do some shootin.
The nice thing about going cheap is that EVERYONE can join in on a game of paintball for little money. So, within a matter of a week, we had about 8 of us with new Talon Ghost guns shooting at each other on my dads 14 acres of wooded/open land.
We had a BLAST and the guns performed GREAT......for us anyways.
What we got out of that small investment was just what we needed to know to justify scaling up; yes we loved it and yes we all wanted to continue with it.
So then we started looking at some higher priced guns.
Some bought the $50 Triton and some went with Rebels. I bought the TL Plus. Found it online for $95. Seemed like the best deal since I was reading that most people had bought it for $120+. I read some of the reviews found here and was impressed with its overall rating.
A deal I couldn't refuse.
Now onto my first review of the gun....
This gun was initially used under EXTREME circumstances (i.e. the temperature was about 30-35). To give a fair review of a product you, obviously, would want to have used it at least once.
This gun was completely out of commision that day.
I wouldnt necessarily blame the gun for that. With a sport like paintball where you have Co2 cannisters and balls filled with liquid.........freezing temperatures is not a good thing.
The balls were busting in the barrel and even in the power feed chamber shooting globs of paint out the side. I might as well have been shooting snowballs to as the Co2 was freezing up and it looked like snow.
Im going to take a guess here and assume that MOST markers/painballs/Co2 tanks would have failed this initial freezing temperature "test".
The gun that DID work though was the $30 one from Wal-Mart. I attribute this to it being plastic. The 12 gram Co2 cartridges fit up in the gun and, because the gun is plastic, it acted as an insulation of sorts for the cartridge. The balls still chopped every now and then but because of the pump action you could pretty much be assured that you were going to get a ball to come out......
Eventually even the Talons began to freeze up. Instead of the 40+ shots we would normally get we were getting about 20.
The next day we played again. This time the temperature was about 40-45 and the sun was out. I bought two cheapo scarves and some safety pins and, just in case, wrapped one around my Co2 tank and one around my paintball hopper to keep them somewhat warm.
The gun worked like a charm. As the day wore on the temperature began to drop and, eventually....right at the very end....it began to freeze up again but for the 3+ hours we played I was a shootin fool.
Accuracy was ok but could have been better if that friggin hurricane wasnt ripping through the play area (thats what the winds seemed like anyways). But even with the huge wind gusts I was able to place a good shot after some initial (3 or 4 shots) "honing in".
The gun never once chopped a ball (until later when the temperature dropped to freezing again). Sighting is a joke since the feeder crosses right over the barrel. The sight rail that comes with the gun is...well...pointless. You HAVE to sight down the side of the barrel which, at times, can make for some interesting shots. Taking it apart is SUPER easy and I appreciate that when someone shoots my gun or it gets dirty otherwise. Apart and back together in no time.
Under the circumstances I found that the gun performed pretty well. The real test will come when I play indoors or this spring when we dont have snow on the ground, the temperature isnt below 35 and the monsoon like winds stop.
The gun is heavy with a 20oz tank and I can see the advantage of having a drop forward. Im not going to tell you to buy a new barrel, grip, etc because Im sure what you want to hear is how this gun performs out of the box....for the money you spend. Not how "great" it could be after you throw in another $300.
I like this gun. Its reliable, easy to use and I find that it works great for my needs with no extra money required (except for the drop forward).
One last thing. The manual that comes with it REALLY sucks. If you have questions about uncocking the gun or how to detach the Co2 tank you're on your own (or ask someone who knows). The manual is useless. Even the exploded diagram of the gun can be a little tricky at first when trying to take it apart (which you need to do initially to lube the o-rings and such). After the first time though youll see the simplicity of it and wont need to decipher the diagram again.
As for the cheapo Wal-Mart guns.....we let new people use them. Not semi-autos but, again, for the money spent these guns continue to go a long ways for us and others. Thanks Brass Eagle!
(and thanks Kingman for making me a true fan of paintball with a reliable gun!)
Maybe a better barrell
Get rid of the beavertail and other black metal 'decorations'
Straight out of the box use
Excellent for beginner players
Chops balls even at a medium shooting rate
Nasty Weld Jobs on the loader spout
I purchsed this Marker about two years ago just after going paintballing once and right out of the box it was easily put together and assembled. In a matter of minutes I was out in my backyard shooting at some tin cans.
The Spyder TL+ takes some time to get used to the accuracy due to the stock barrel but once you have the general set up memorized it's fairly easy to place a shot where you want it to go. The stock barrel makes it difficult to place long shots and keep them near your target.
During my ownage of the marker I have only chopped about 3-5 balls out of a good 7,000 shots that have been through it. But when a ball does get chopped it gets nasty, the stock barrel is difficult to completely clean but the easily strippable body of the TL+ allows semi-easy cleaning of the inside. However, the right side loading gets in the way while trying to fully clean it out.
I have yet to have a leak of air anywhere in the marker but then again I've changed all of my O-Rings about once every 2 months.
The front grip is fairly comfortable to hold onto and allows you to keep the light marker close to your body so you can keep your low profile. The right-side loading, however, is a bit of a nuissence because the balls are loaded quite slowly, unless you play with an electric loader. Which is a deffinate must for this Gun unless you're just looking to lay down a couple shots every once and a while.
The Trigger is quite comfortable even if you're wearing gloves. A easy to hold onto design allows minnimal slippage. A Reccommended upgrade would be to throw a little bit of grip tape down onto the trigger so you can pull it without having to worry about slipping off the trigger and missing that important shot.
Not reccomended if you have already owned a marker before but it would make a decent backup if you're looking for one. However I reccommend that you find a TL+ Used because it may be decent but not worth the retail price.
I would deffinately reccomend this Marker to anyone who has purchased some WalMart marker and wants to get into the game more. However there are many other markers that you should test out first before you settle on a TL+
Drop forward- a dye altralight barrel or boomstick
Doesn't chop balls-field stripable - you don't need to repair it
it needs a drop forward or remote- a dye barrel
I started paintball about six months ago. After that day I was hooked on paintball. I played paintball with rental guns for about three months. One of my friends was selling his Tl Plus so he cold by an AMG. I decided to by his gun. When I bought the gun it came with a remote. So far the remote has been ok but it some times new o rings replaced. The first thing I am probably by for this gun is a drop forward. One thing you have to make sure is to keep it oiled. If you don't keep it oiled the ventruri bolt will sart to get hard to cock it. All so when it you need to oil it the gun will started to make a high pitch ting sound when you shoot it. So far the gun has been great. It doesn't chop balls. Another thing that is really nice is that it is really easy to clean the gun inside and out. For me this was a perfect gun to start out. This is a perfect gun to start out with. If you want to start shooting faster one thing that will help is an electronic trigger
This is a great gun to start out with and a good gun for serious paintballers.
i have tried almost every paintball gun, but i would say all spyders are related/similar to this one.
-IPI fram (one of the esprit)
-bob long torp. regulator
-cp drop foward
-maddman rocket valve
-sp 12' teardrop
i highly recomend getting a new barrel such as the cp one-piece and a drop foward otherwise the gun itself is too long.
see my review on the gun
in my review below
really in all i think is that this gun is user friendly and in whole is a very good gun. also it is getting very cheap (85 at paintballgateway.com). there are no certain aspects of the gun that i can say. though it is very light compared to a tipman 98. the key strengths are that this marker is simple/user-friendly gun. a lot of people say there gun stinks if it has a small leak or something that can be easily fixed. in whole this gun has served me well. no major problems have happened to it. first of i have to say that the it can be fieldstripped very easily (which helps alot if you have to oil you gun which you should do often) it can be upgraded , as you can see mine is pretty upgraded and shoots considerable good. accuracy is not an effect of the gun. it is the BARREL to Paint match only. good gun all-around.
-looks very cool with certain upgrades
-looks very cool with certain upgrades
-the gun can have good range/accuracy with a good barrel/paint
-gun can be efficent w/ a good valve
-can shot fast with an electronic trigger frame
-can be constant w/ a GOOD regulator (no PE inlines or kingman bottomlines)
there is no "weaknesses" that arent deserved. so if you leave it around and dont clean it and oil it proparely it will not be good. i think that oiling is very important in a gun. reallt the only thing i can think of is that it is "not-solid"
i highly suggest that any newbie buys this gun. it is what teaches a paintballer about there gun. basic idea on how a paintball gun works. very very very good beginer gun
Reliable and very easy to take apart and put back together. This Gun is awesome
Stock Barrel Sorta stinks
I bought this gun used at ebay for 160 with all the accessories. I played with it in the back yard. And shot about 2000 rounds threw it. I was very suprised the way it shot . No balls Choped it was smoth. This is my first Gun besides the Talon. I am an avid paintball player and this gun is the best for the price range
Buy this gun it is very cheap and reliable. It is worth the 70 bucks
Could have alittle better barrel, bolt, and Ball detent.
Well i got this gun for xmas about 4 years ago. I was totally exited because i had been previously been playin with a piece of crap ( Brass Eagle Silver Raptor). It was choppin paint left and right. So when i got this gun it was awesome lookin right outta the box. Went out on the day after xmas with sum friends. It was mind blowing. This thing was shootin the paintballs rather than blending them, not only that but they were flying fairly straight. So i continue to use this gun and will probably never let it go. As you can see with my setup (and many others that are more crazy) there are tons of choices for upgrades making this one of the best starting-mid/ high level players.
I reccomend this product because it was the nicest thing in the world for me to start with and i wouldnt have started with anything else. EVER.
Tipmann 98 - TL Plus was more accurate out of the box (at least compared to the 98's back when my TL Plus was new)
Orignal Spyder - TL Plus was better all around (no surprise there)
Spyder Imagine - I guess they are about equal, TL is just not electric. I didn't get to shoot the Imagine enough to comapre accuracy. Imagine was louder by just a little.
TL Plus, 14 oz tank, 200 round hopper
14" 32 Degrees Whisper barrel
All of my marker is black--tank, body, barrell, (uploaded a pic for your viewing pleasure!!)
Barrel, maybe new trigger set up (so I've heard), more comfortable grips (the standard grips are too small for my big hands)
Very reliable and easy to use. Shoots fairly accurately. Looks good. Lots of possible upgrades.
A little loud. Trigger pull is longer than I would prefer. A little heavy.
I purchased this marker in 1998, 1999 (can't remember exactly). I played with it for about a year and then quit playing paintball all throughout college. I recently started playing again and I was very surprised when I took it out and put a tank on it, it worked perfectly!! I did, however, put new o-rings and little oil on it before I got to the field, just to be safe.
I was infinitely more accurate than the rentals (piranhas). It performed as just like when it was new and I got a lot of people out. Rate of Fire isn't anywhere near newer electrics, but I don't need 20 balls per second to hit someone.
I have never chopped a ball in this gun--not even one. I just purchased a 14" barrel, but I haven't gotten to play with it enough to comment on how the markder performs with it. I'll update here asap.
I don't see the point in the sight rail. I think it's mainly cosmetic--Kingman was probably hoping it made the marker look more aggressive. I thought about taking it off, but I thought the marker looked stupid without it, so I left it on. The other problem with taking off the sight rail means taking off the beavertail. Some people don't like it, but I would rather have the beavertail than just a bolt going back and forth with nothing protecting it (and keeping me from putting my mask too close!!)
My hands are a little to big for the stock grips. They are acceptable, I guess, but some decent grips would be a good upgrade
This was a great gun to learn off of. I absolutely love it. After improving past nOOb stage, I still feel the marker is good enough to compete with the newer, high priced markers. Other than the trigger pull, I don't have any issues with it--even the stock barrel was good considering the age and cost of the gun.
I saw one of these go on ebay for about $40 (if I remember correctly). For that kind of price, you can't go wrong. If you are new to the sport, or just need a good reliable marker for a good price, this is it.
9 out of 10
Last edited on Sunday, July 16th, 2006 at 7:25 pm PST
Brass Eagle Raptor, AGD Automag, Spyder Electra, 2002 STO Autococker
Black powerfeed Automag
lvl 10 (best upgrade for a mag)
Intelliframe with intellifeed system hooked up to my 12v revy
Black DYE stickies; chrome flame drop forward and chrome foregrip
14in DYE boomstick
68/3000 ACI bulldog hpa tank
Spyder TL Plus with ACI 6 stage Sub-Zero expansion chamber
Core PT Professional with Ronin Holster
Expansion chamber (for cold weather play if you're using CO2)
Inexpensive, easy to maintain, very reliable
accuracy, inconsistent in cold weather
This marker has served me well over the past year when i really started getting into paintball. I play mostly woods ball, including big scenario games so that's the point of view i will be writing from. Since i play a lot now i have upgraded to a higher end gun but i still keep the TL plus as a backup. I think this marker is an excellent choice for beginners since it is incredibly easy to maintain and fix if anything goes wrong. Not to mention it is also very cheap, ebay has great deals on any gun. This gun has never broken down on me during play and rarely chops balls. If you do chop a ball, it is very easy to clean. In fact, my TL plus has been used every time I've played since I got my new gun by one of my friends since their gun would go down and the TL always finished out the day. The biggest problem with this gun is it's performance in cold weather. When temperatures drop below 50 degrees the TL plus will often not be able to chrono above 240 fps. This problem is easily fixed with an expansion chamber for C02 or you could just use compressed air (although an hpa tank is very expensive and only necessary for people who play a lot or have expensive guns). The stock chamber is really only useful as a foregrip. The accuracy on this gun is not all that great. The blow back system it uses is very simple (making it easy to take apart and maintain) but it makes for inconsistent amounts of air or C02 traveling through the bolt causing shots to vary in distance. Really accuracy in a paintball gun is the consistancy of the air output on the ball. I wouldn't recommend upgrading the barrel, because you would only see minimal accuracy changes and if you need to be very accurate than you should save your money for a more expensive gun.
This gun is good for any beginners or people who are interested in paintball but don't know very much about the sport because of it's ease of maintaining, its simplicity, and it's low cost. If you're just starting out or don't play that often, it's not worth it to spend hundreds or even a thousand dollars on a gun to have better accuracy. Really this gun will be accurate enough for most players who aren't looking to spend a lot on a gun. The TL plus is built for the average rec player who enjoys the game, but not for the serious tournment player who competes to win. I'll give it a 9 because i think it's the best beginner/intermediate gun out there, but then there is that cold weather problem that keeps it from a 10.
ICD Bko, spyder sonix(tested), '03 vert autococker(tested), '98 custom( tested), Angel IR3(tested), E-99(tested), and a whole lot of really high class guns.
Green ICD BKO, matching green aa barrel, green sticky grip, 12v revy, 48ci 3000psi pure energy tank.
Spyder TL plus, matching aa barrel, 12v revy, 12ounce co2(occasionally I stick on my air),
Upgrade the stock barrel, but other then that nothing is really necassary, you might want a revy, but thats only if your a fast shooter : )
Hardly ever has problems, almost never breaks balls, pretty accurate and consistent with new barrel
in a while gun must be lubed or it becomes a total b**ch.
This is a great beginner gun. It's incredibly reliable, and kingman's customer service is great (though I only called once.) this gun for a beginner is incredible, its easy to take apart, but when you take it apart the first time look how it goes back or you'll be screwed, but after the first time its easy.
As I said this things a B**ch when not lubed, it'll break balls, the fps will go way down, it also will sputter a lot, And it is hard to cock. But when this gun is lubed it hardly ever has any problems at all, it's great.
When you get the gun you should probably get a new barrel, cause the stock one is really bad, it's not as bad as some other stock barrels but you should upgrade it to an all american or something along those lines, if you do get the aa run diablo through it it works the best.
This gun is a great gun compared to other beginning guns( Spyders, tippmans, brass eagles, piranhas, etc.) but when up against Angels, BKOs, Autocockers, Impulses, and stuff in that range, the TL plus is low on the scale. nowhere near as fast or accurate but it's reliablity and quality is right up there with the the angels and autocockers.
I love this gun it's reliable and very affordable fom the right place. Great beginner gun buy it above all else, its great, you never have problems unless it needs lubing.
I recommend this marker to anyone who wants an incredible beginning gun at a reasonable price, buy it above all else, I love it and you will to : )
this rating is based on other beginning guns not angels and autocockers and that sort cause against them it gets about a 3 or so, my rating is based on other beginning guns.
10 out of 10
Last edited on Thursday, September 18th, 2003 at 9:54 am PST
Spyder Sonix (close but not as good)
Diablo Sabotage (not even close)
Sheridan XGS (what a peice of crap; TL Plus is in another league)
Many Brass Eagles (not in the same league)
Black Spyder TL Plus with 32 Degrees Gel Grips, 16" All American Barrel, Red Dot Sight, 20oz CO2 Tank with 32 Degrees on/off Valve and Butt Plate
Ease of upgrade
The stock barrel is not accurate nor precise (as with all guns)
This gun is a steal at the prices they are selling them for now. It is easily upgradeable, very durable, and in my opinion a great gun for those just starting out in paintball and also for somebody who has been around the sport and wants a gun to upgrade. This gun has never given me a single problem since I bought it. I went a different way than most with this semi by turning it into a sniper rifle, and it continues to impress me and annoy anyone who is unfortunate enough to be caught in my sights.
This gun is excellent and commands the utmost respect from anyone who plays and loves this sport. This gun is very reputable and I definately recommend this gun to anyone with $90. Great Deal!
10 out of 10
Last edited on Monday, July 7th, 2003 at 7:16 pm PST